My wife Kate hails from Birmingham, Alabama, it’s in one of the only blue counties in the entire state. I still get on her about the bible-beating ways down there — Alabama and Mississippi provide a lot of fertile material for political blogging.
That said, there are living, breathing progressives there — I know quite a few, and Alabama has a plentiful population of LGBTs — forging out a path in a sometimes outwardly hostile environment. You have to remember that not everyone wants to live in deep Blue areas of the country. There’s nothing wrong with the South — I hail from the mid-Atlantic South — North Carolina, which is markedly less conservative, but shares quite a bit of the Southern culture (and remember “southern culture” is more than “white southern culture” people). North Carolina has progressed in politically dramatically different fashion compared to deep South states when it comes to batsh*t conservatism. Now I’ll give you that NC’s GOP is retrograde, full of good old boy bigots, but the general assembly’s composition is tempered somewhat by the Dems living in the 21 century.
My friend Rep. Patricia Todd (D), the only out member of the Alabama state legislature, has managed to carve out a successful, groundbreaking career there, breaking down barriers in a state that has a long way to go. We need to remember and support folks doing the tough sledding in Red states.
NC’s the home of the very successful — and accurate when it comes to gauging the South — polling outlets, Public Policy Polling took a peek at some cultural political attitudes in Alabama and Mississippi — those states hold their primaries tomorrow, and it is a real eye-opener. This is mindset of the average GOP primary voter — it’s a frightening trip in the DeLorean:
- There’s considerable skepticism about Barack Obama’s religion with Republican voters in them. In Mississippi only 12% of voters think Obama’s a Christian to 52% who think he’s a Muslim and 36% who are not sure. In Alabama just 14% think Obama’s a Christian to 45% who think he’s a Muslim and 41% who aren’t sure.Mitt Romney dominates the ‘Obama’s a Christian’ vote in both states. He leads Santorum 42-28 with those folks in Mississippi and has a 38-21 lead over him with them in Alabama. In Mississippi Newt’s winning the ‘Obama’s a Muslim’ vote 39-28, but in Alabama it’s a three way tie with all of the leading candidates at 31%.
- Alabama’s pretty much on board with interracial marriage, with 67% of voters thinking it should be legal to 21% who think it should not be. There’s still some skepticism in Mississippi though- only 54% of voters think it should be legal, while 29% believe it should be illegal. Newt cleans up with the ‘interracial marriage should be illegal’ crowd in both states. He’s up 40-27 on Romney with them in Mississippi and 37-28 with them in Alabama.
- Finally there’s considerable skepticism about evolution among GOP voters in both Alabama and Mississippi. In Alabama only 26% of voters believe in it, while 60% do not. In Mississippi just 22% believe in it, while 66% do not. Romney wins the ‘voters who believe in evolution’ vote (33-27 over Gingrich in Alabama, 38-32 over Gingrich in Mississippi.) Santorum wins the ‘voters who don’t believe in evolution’ vote (34-33 over Gingrich in both Alabama and Mississippi with Romney at 26%)
I don’t know what century these GOP folks live in, or what direction they believe the country should be moving culturally. Do they really think their political views will prevail? If not, how do they cope with living in 21st century America, where the population is getting browner, the LGBTs are increasingly out of the closet, and women and men are having non-procreative sex?




40 Comments


Thanks to Mississippi in particular for demonstrating why the US Constitution doesn’t permit rights like marriage to be up to a majority vote.
Horribly, I think one reason there is so much “I don’t know” is because all they really know is he’s Black, and don’t want to know much more after that.
Also, I think the ones who think islam is that they are confusing him with Malcolm X (also lived in Hyde Park Chicago).. you know they all look alike.
What I’d like to see is a breakdown of these percentages by age groups; those in their 30s, 40s, 50s, 60s and above. That would be the real eye-opener.
“•Finally there’s considerable skepticism about evolution among GOP voters in both Alabama and Mississippi.”
————-
And, let’s be honest, were one to examine those two states, one could make a very strong argument AGAINST evolution.
And yet, and yet: Mississippi voted down its Personhood Amendment with about 2/3rds of voters voting NO. Every single one of the remaining four GOP Clowns would have voted YES they say.
The GOP presidential field is therefore to the RIGHT of Mississippi, which ascribes to the views as stated in Pam’s post.
Huh.
easier to see why santorum thinks education is “snob” ish….he can lead uneducated folks around by their nose….i mean religion….i mean …..ah hell you know what i mean…..inquisition…..
What we have heah… is a failuh…. to cummmunicate.
I think a lot of those “Don’t know” folks hear things like “Barack”… and “Hussein”… and “Obama” and really do believe that since he isn’t named William Harold Smith, he MUST be a furriner, and one of them there moslems.
People like (sadly) my Dad (92) who just cannot fathom that someone with such an unusual name could possibly be an American Christian.
ohohoh! pick me! pick me!
The white evangelical types wish it were 1862, everyone else is glad it isn’t!
I for one am still amazed that NASA has facilities in both Mississippi and Alabama. I always figured that they were just there to prove Junior can launch a possum to the ionosphere just using that new cattle guard on his pickup truck. And I can say that too cause I’m from Alabama and got a ton of family there and Mississippi!
Faster than you can say “Elmer Gantry” I’m skeptical of any public figure’s professed religion as only they know what they believe in their minds versus what they say and do for political gain. I think Obama will say whatever he thinks will play best with the public, not that he’s some closet Muslim, but just a selfish, manipulative person.
I think of the movie Spartacus with the conversation between a young Caesar and Gracchus about public exhibitions of religion:
Gracchus: Let’s make an old-fashioned sacrifiice for Glabrus’ success.
Caesar: I thought you had reservations about the gods.
Gracchus: Privately I believe in none ofthem. Neither do you. Publicly I believe in them all.
Further proof that the country isn’t as right as people tell us! But these poll results make me wonder.
Do these people believe in air?
I guess it’s not in the bible & if it is, it would have fallen off the edge of the earth anyhow.
Cynthia Tucker just commented on Chris Matthews that her home state (Alabama) remains “a hotbed of ignorance and bigotry.” As a resident of your next door neighbor living in a 98% Republican voting county I would say it is not limited to Alabama. But I am beginning to wonder if we shouldn’t consider the states of the Confederacy to have been successful in secession to be treated by the rest of the country as another nation– come to think of it they have.
The banks occupied the south then the first place the northern industrialists outsourced to was the deep south. Maybe a more accurate way for us who try to endure as liberals perhaps we best think of it as living in a third world nation under imperial occupation. We are all Mexican and Chinese and Indian now.
If one wants to know why North Carolina is unlike the rest of the South, it can be summed up in three short words:
Frank Porter Graham
I’m not sure, but I have long figured that the target date for most social conservatives/talibangelicals was around AD 950-1050.
Pam, it seems to me that the folks you’re siting just don’t think in these sort of global, historical, or larger over-all cultural terms. Period.
In Mississippi only 12% of voters think Obama’s a Christian to 52% who think he’s a Muslim. In Alabama just 14% think Obama’s a Christian to 45% who think he’s a Muslim.
I’m not from the south but I live now in Louisiana and have been here about 15 years. So I know how Republican white southerners are. Still I have to wonder if that many people REALLY believe Obama is a Muslim. If a trusted friend were to ask the question in confidence would some of these people answer differently than they responded to a poll?
I would love to know the response of American voters to the following questions:
Is Obama a liar? Yes – No – Don’t know
Is Obama a murderer? Yes – No – Don’t know
Is Obama a traitor? Yes – No – Don’t know
Gee Pam, I wish we all be as smart as you. Yes indeed, Birmingham-Jefferson County is dominated, as are many major urban areas, by Democrats. And Jefferson County is currently, as are many major urban areas, bankrupt. It escapes me why the rest of the state isn’t clamoring for that kind of leadership!
About this polling? A quick wiki check describes PPP as a Democrat run polling service. Not that there is anything wrong with that. You have suggested that these responses are from likely Republican voters. With that in mind, I bet you a dvd box set of Portlandia that if the interracial marriage acceptance question was ask of only African-American respondents, the results would be similar.
A Republican in Alabama is probably a Christian. Christians don’t generally embrace evolution. Is this breaking news? Tell you what, get back to me when you know what was here before the big bang. I am open to persuasion.
And finally about the century of choice. Islamist long for the 7th century. The greenies are wishing it was the 12th. I am ok with the current century.
Cynthia Tucker – ha! Ms. Tucker is the most bitter, hateful, race baiting bigot that still appears in print.
BTW, The “global” spelling of siting is actually c-i-t-i-n-g.
Pam, have you ever read Jessica Mitford’s “Poison Penmanship?” There’s an excellent chapter about her travels through the civil rights-era south that is both enlightening and pants-wetting here and there.
Montgomery, Alabama: “At last, people have stopped saying “this isn’t the real South.”
Nashville, Tennessee: “Do Athenians call their city the Nashville of Greece?”
Birmingham, Alabama: “That’ll open your ass, ” he said. “Thunderstruck, I then realized he meant ‘eyes.’”
This post was a real ass opener.
Since you are obviously some kind of scholar, study the following. The Democrat Party held a strangle-hold on the old deep south from the end of the Civil War until Ronald Reagan Was elected. That would be Mississippi, Alabama, Georgia, Tennessee, Kentucky and the Carolinas. You could not win an election as a Republican at any level of government, save the very rare protest election. What was up with that? I will give you a clue. Lincoln was a Republican. Republicans were not welcome in the klan either. Ouch!
And they wonder why we think they’re stupid.
You’re just pissed that she’s speaking the truth about people like you.
You got me on that one. It won’t be the last time I incorrectly use homonyms, if my past is prologue.
Are you are thinking of Cynthia McKinney? Cynthia Tucker once Opinion page editor of the AJC now U of Ga. faculty and columnist. She is decidedly not bat shit crazy conservative.
This is not the place to try to develop or explain my theory (purely based on my personal take from living here a long time) but I believe what we see in the south is the result of profoundly embedded racism rooted in the history of a culture dependent on slavery. These people remain so fearful of black retribution or dominance they have had to take on an entirely different narrative of how the world is put together.
For example fear of a black person will get a decent living wage from unionization they work for nothing themselves. Or another that in fear the babies of black women will get decent care they minimize medical and nutritional care available for all the poor. Their Christianity is no more than the Christianity all over the world. The local brand fits the prejudices of the people.
Try to talk politics with any of them and it gets back to not wanting to take care of shiftless lazy drugged men and single mothers. Their resentment is deep.
It is not only AL and MS. The problem with the South predates the Civil War and is intertwined with the concept of “Southern chivalry” and “states rights”, the latter of which is a justification for enslaving other human beings for the purpose of enhancing the wealth of rich plantation owners, and the “rights” of the territories of the west to choose to be slaveholding states. Civil war historians mention that the Confederate camps were rife with tent revival meetings to the point that the entire camps could be described as one giant revival. Tent revivals took place in the Yankee camps, too, but were much more sparsely attended, probably due to the large numbers of Irish Catholic and German Lutherans that made up the ranks of the Northern army and who were not very susceptible to the evangelical message. After the Armistice, this particular brand of Southern myth and revivalism spawned the Ku Klux Klan and subsequent generations of Southern bigots.
Well, up until the Civil Rights Act was signed, the Southern Dems were the bigot party–the Republicans were never forgiven for winning the Civil War and freeing the ni**ers. Johnson knew that the Old South would be lost to the Dems “for a generation” when he signed the CRA, and famously said so. The bigoted Dems of the South became the bigoted Republicans of the South, because a Democrat President signed a law to put a stop to their bigoted practices. Those same bigots have been punishing the Democrats for 30 plus years, now.
It would be wrong to think all the stupid people are in Miss. and Ala. We even have some in Texas.
You are nothing if not succinct. In one paragraph, you had all the Democrats re-stripe themselves as Republicans. You will need three or four paragraphs to properly disperse the twisted logic needed to pull this one off.
I am going to share something with you. The first major civil rights act was passed in – wait for it – 1957. It was a campaign promise made by Ike. But after Congress passed the final version, voting rights and other key provisions had been stripped out by the man who ruled the Senate. None other than Lyndon B. Johnson.
And it was Jimma Carter that signed the CRA into law. Sorry.
FortMorgan, you cannot even use Wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_Rights_Act_of_1964
I’m done.
The shift of the Democrats is more complicated than that. Many many who call themselves Democrats and vote for candidates calling themselves Democrat are little different than their ancestors in their cultural beliefs and practices.
And yes the point of my post was the culture of the once Confederate south was established with the coming of Europeans bringing slaves and slavery. Much of the narrative today is unchanged from long before the secessions. and the Civil War The whole culture including “States rights” is a child of slavery with the freedom to oppress and ignore the US Constitution. This underlies the hatred of the federal government and justifies ignoring the social and intellectual pressures of the rest of the country.
Oooh, another Southern-educated elitist!
What I love about Fort Morgan (Alabama) is that the Alabama traitors attacked the fort before Alabama had even seceded, much less the CSA had been formed.
Typical conservativism…can’t win unless it’s a stab in the back…
Southern Honor!
I am familiar with both. Ms. McKinney makes Ms. Tucker look like Shakespeare. If you are coming at this from the left then you would not detect the vitriol simmering just below the surface with Ms. Tucker. I have read her columns for years and my humble opinion is that she is consumed by her Afro-centricism. Perhaps you and her should have the discussion about absentee fathers and single moms. The resentment is yours.
Your race baiting is completely…gross.
Anytime before 1861 would probably suffice for these fools.
Can’t see any basis for about half of those folks’ belief that he’s Muslim, but neither can I see much basis for the 13% or so believing he’s Christian (other than his self-declaration, which I see no reason to believe any more than his “hope&change” nonsense). Guess I’d have to go with the 35-40% who aren’t sure, but only because there’s not a “Corporatism” choice.
A powerful post, Pam, that calls to mind the classic musical/political/satirical stylings of Tom Lehrer: I Wanna Go Back to Dixie.
“I wanna go back to dixie,
Take me back to dear ol’ dixie,
That’s the only li’l ol’ place for li’l ol’ me.
Ol’ times there are not forgotten,
Whuppin’ slaves and sellin’ cotton,
And waitin’ for the robert e. lee. . . .”
And Teddy’s comment is the icing on the cake.
Thanks for being so affirming in my understanding of the principles driving the southern white prejudices that define its culture. Nothing like a live example.
There are probably even some in New York and Massachusetts, but you’ll never read about them here.
This is only remotely true in the U.S. and other places where reactionary totalitarians claim to speak for all Christians.
Then again, it’s not like you’ve shown much concern for little things like “history” or “facts” in your comments…