premature adulationthey sure do come quickly for that hot chocolate…
it’s true that B has done more of us than anyone else, and i like him for that, but that doesn’t mean we should let him get off without at least making half empty promises to us… what were they thinking? how does this hold him accountable? such a wasted opportunity.

Political IncompetenceI refer to my previous comment:
http://www.pamshouseblend.com/…
DADT is still law, and HRC is throwing out an endorsement a year before the primaries are done.

edit*done more for. (i wish there was an edit feature to hide my typos.)
but yeah, HRC could have bargained a bit before pimping us out like a cheap #governmenthooker  

“profound change”?!?!?!?If what we’ve gotten from Obama is “profound change,” what on earth do they think “a few paltry bread crumbs” would look like?
Endorsing Obama this early in the race–without even demanding any promises or concessions from him–makes no political sense whatever.  Calling HRC a puppet of the DNC, which is exactly what some of us have been saying for years, is a drastic understatement.   They are, in everything but name, an actual branch of the DNC, with the mission to keep the LGBT community in line.  
They do not speak for this gay man, at least.  Even if I thought Obama had been genuinely good for our community, even if he had not engaged in rather insulting and transparent tokenism, the fact remains that he’s been a horrible president on virtually every other issue he’s touched.  SIX wars, cozying up to the corporations, caving on health care, authorizing assassination squads to take out American citizens, keeping Gitmo open, ramping up government surveillance of Americans, convicting Bradley Manning in public statements, funneling public money to churches, and on and on and on.  (And I’d bet the farm he’s getting ready to cave on social security, too.)
I’m a person of conscience; I couldn’t vote for him and look myself in the mirror.  This man outdoes even Richard Nixon in his overt contempt for the constitution and democratic processes.  

If you support Obama or his Republican rival…You automatically support the six wars of imperial aggression he’s currently fighting, leading to the mass murder of civilians and the wastage of GI’s lives
You automatically support his policy of refusing to prosecute Bush and Clinton for the crimes they committed in office and his refusal to prosecute the owners of BP, Massey Energy and Haliburton for the murders of rig workers and miners.
You automatically support FISA, the Paytriot Act and his use of Clinton-Bush carryovers like the kidnapping, torture and murder of political and military opponents like Bradley Manning. You automatically support the concentration camps in Baghdad, Guantanamo and Bagram.
You automatically support union busting.
You automatically support putting Medicare/Medicaid and Social Security ‘on the table’.
You automatically support the artificial maintenance of high levels of unemployment, wage cuts for federal workers and the export of jobs through ‘Free’ Trade Agreements. You automatically support policies that permit homelessness and foreclosures, that cut into the standard of living of working people and that will prolong the depression.  
You automatically support the trillions in giveaways to banksters and other predatory lenders.
You automatically support the denial of federal payments for abortions.
You automatically support the disgusting racism inherent in the denial of health care for imported and immigrant workers and in support for the zionist policies of ethnic cleansing in Palestine.
The AFL-CIO is threatening to withdraw support from Democrats and why 29 million voters deserted them from 2008 to 2010. That’s why activists and leaders of many movements and communities are rising up to say “No More, A Curse on Both Your Houses”. Obama and the Democrats are moving steadily to the right, making concession after concession to the Teabaggers. And make no mistake about it, their refusal to repeal Clintons DOMA and to enact ENDA or a CRA in the two years they ran Congress were a concession to the bigot vote and to Teabaggers.
Neither party offers anything worth supporting. The only real way forward is the militant, mass action path taken by the Arab/muslim workers uprising.

Walk like an Egyptian.
 

Maybe it doesn’t need an edit. They have ‘done more of us’ in the sense of betraying more of us and screwing more of us over than the Republicans.
We never expected anything but hatred from the GOP and that’s what we got. Some people foolishly expeceted more from Obama and got thrown under the bus for that mistake, repeatedly.
(No one needs an edit feature more than me.)

Yes, Obama has done more for usthan John Tyler, Millard Fillmore, Rutherford B. Hayes, Calvin Coolidge and both Bushes.  But,um, so what?  That’s setting the bar so low it’s practically underground.

What!??? The HRC are tools????

Heh.While it might be true that Obama has done disappointingly little in terms of “big ticket” gay rights, it weighs more in my mind that he has done more actual good for trans people than every other politician and lobbyist on the national stage in put together. The perception that he has “done nothing for LGBT” is very much a fiction of Gay Incorporated, who consider their pet causes to be the be all and end all of LGBT rights.
Civil rights isn’t inherently a liberal-only cause, but I am done with the pretense that there “might be” a viable pro-LGBT or even LGBT-neutral Republican candidate. There isn’t, and there won’t be at any point in the foreseeable future. For all their cowardice and incompetence, the Democrats are all we have to work with so long as the fundie-lolbertarian-teabagger Axis of Insane runs the party.
As for HRC and GOProud, a pox upon both their corrupt, stinking, hypocritical houses. I would sooner break bread with Judas Iscariot than with either of them.

Yes, in fact, Fred Karger IS a non-starter.The only reason he’s in the clown car at the moment is because the baggers don’t give a shit about him one way or another. He’s gone after the Iowa Caucuses because he won’t even get 1% of the vote.

perfect

If we had a real political system…In a somewhat more just world (or nation), we’d have the Democrats and the Socialists trying to outdo each other in courting the T vote (along with the LGB), with the Republicans scrambling for the votes of the bigots and the occasional LGBT CEO.  At least the Democrats are moving towards the “we’ll actively stand up and demand slightly more equal treatment for you than would be allowed by the GOP” attitude for trans* people that they currently hold towards LGB people…though that’s a tremendously depressing state of affairs generally.

What a simplistic world you live in.Mine is much more complex.

It’s telling, really.By which I mean that it’s telling that the cissexual gay community doesn’t see that this President has done more for transgender rights than any other national-scale politician in the history of the country.
Why, it’s almost as if cissexual queers don’t see trans rights as important, or as a community priority.

You’re so right.I lack the defect that produces the ‘complex’ gyrations and excuse mongering necessary to justify supporting the Democrat/Republicans wars, their attacks on working people or their bigotry.
If you want to support that be my guest, but call it by its right name.
 

You’ll pardon me if I decline to support a president who orders the mass murder of civilians, who refuses to end unemployment and who stands convicted of multiple counts of being a lap dog of the rich and of anti-GLBT bigotry, racism and misogyny.
You can get your fill of that but don’t invite the antiwar movement, the LGBT communities, working people and unions, the homeless, people cheated out of good (socialized) medical care, or immigrant and imported workers etc., to your party. We couldn’t stomach it.  
Why it’s as if some people can’t see the forest for the tree.

They could have at least waited for DADTto actually get repealed.
Then again, maybe they are not aware is actually hasn’t been yet?

It’s telling that no topic can’t be twistedso it can serve as a vehicle to demonstrate how evil LGB people are to T people.
This cisgendered GWM does know and recognize how this admin has helped the T community and I think it’s one of the cooler aspects of his thus far, mediocre presidency. And overall think his endorsement was inevitable.
That doesn’t make it smart politics for HRC to give the farm away 18 months out. HRC could have held out to pressure the Admin to freeze deportation proceedings against binational gay couples. Or issue an Excutive Order requiring an LGBT non-discrimination policy from companies seeking a government contract. (Which would benefit the T community a great deal.)
Or you know, ACTUALLY repeal DADT, not just say he did and hold a signing ceremony.
But HRC has essentially handed the admin a free pass to ignore the LGBT cobstituency until 2013.
Anytime in the next two years an LGB OR T person suggests we need or want more the admin can just trot out Joe to do what he does best: undermine progress.  

You’ll pardon me if I decline to support your voting modelWe tried doing it the Rorschach way – “No compromise, not even in the face of armageddon” – last November and the results are very, depressingly clear across the entire continent. Refusing to compromise tactically in order to win strategically results in losing with your morals intact.
I lay on the doorstep of no-compromise liberals the Bradlee Dean Marriage Discrimination Amendment, its North Carolina counterpart, and thousands of anti-choice laws either passed or on the brink of passing nationwide.

sigh.You can act like trans anger at the cis-GL establishment is illegitimate all you want, but that doesn’t address it or make it go away.

“cis-GL establishment”, or “cissexual gay community”?These are different things.  Which are you commenting on?  
If cis-GL establishment, what organizations are you including in that category besides HRC?

This is why I love you Pamyou’re not afraid to take on HRC in what is obviously nothing more than an attempt by Joe Solmonese to puff up his credentials.
What does the LGBT community gain by saying “you’re our man” this early in the election process? We have no cards left to play.
While I applaud President Obama for “obviously better than McCain would have been” treatment of our community, I wouldn’t call his support that overwhelming to warrant this kind of early response from HRC.
Again, they only serve to prove that they appear to be a puppet of the DNC and not champion we need for our cause.

A Republican is a racist right centrist with a theocrat attached at the hip. Democrat politicians are Republicans in drag.One of your fundamental blunders is in identifying our communities with the political prostitutes who run the Democrat and Republican parties and the rich who own them. They want money and power. We want equality and have nothing in common with Democrats or Republicans.
Another blunder is pretending that anyone but christer bigots like Obama, the Clintons, Leah Daughtry and their  Republican cousins are responsible for inequality. You speak as if the bigotry of Democrats like Barney the Quisling represent the opinions of entire communities and that’s not true. Get a clue. Get several clues.
And your third, and far and away worst blunder is your cavalier dismissal of the depression, Obama and the Democrats endless wars with their murder of civilians and wastage of GI lives, his malign neglect of working people, people of color and his bigotry as mere ‘tactical’ issues.
Here’s a news flash for all you Democrats –  it doesn’t matter a bit which right wing party wins. You Democrats are mirror images of Log Cabin Republicans and your partisan squabbling and turf wars are unimportant to real social change.
The losses you Democrats had last fall were the result of your party’s betrayals of every group in its base. In the LGBT communities those losses represented the dawning recognition of most that Obama and the Democrats are just as much our enemy as the Republicans.
The looter rich much prefer working with Democrats like Obama and the Clintons – they’re greedier, they fool more people and they’re able to get away with a lot more than Republicans.

Why?Why are there some trans people (happily, a small minority) who seem determined to find some reason to take offense at everything any LGB person says or does?  It happens time and time again, and it smacks a lot ore of pathology than of any sort of trans sensibility.  If you seriously think that LGB people are the ones holding you down, you really need to rethink.

It’s not “the LGBT community”it’s the HRC.  
I didn’t give money or time to Obama, nor did I vote for him…don’t plan to again.

Don’t think the objections apply to the Presidential raceIf HRC had come out with a statement that they support all the Democratic candidates, sight unseen, in all the races next year, this would be a very valid objection.
But I can’t see that there is any possibility of any Republican (or Tea Party, if they split off) or Libertarian, if they run independently candidate for President who will even speak out as neutral about gay rights, much less being pro-equality.
It’s tactically premature, but not conceptually invalid. On election day 2012, there is only going to be one candidate for President on the ballot with even a moderately pro-gay stand. That will be Obama.

I agree, but I’d go further.We need to recognize that the viable pro-equality candidates in American politics are exclusively Democratic and independent. The Log Cabin Republicans and GOProud offer us nothing but pipe dreams, stalking horses, and Manchurian candidates.

The difference between President Obama and the other guys isTwo to three Supreme Court justices.
If a Republican gets into the Presidency in 2012, he or she will get to nominate the next two or three justices – and with the current political stance of the Republican Party, that will be a complete disaster. We can COUNT on the next two or three Republican-nominated Supreme Court justices to be Teabaggers, which means NOTHING but bad things for the rights of individual citizens, ESPECIALLY LGBT citizens.
You might fantasize about armed rebellion against a right-wing theocracy-thugocracy – I DON’T.
And your cute little saying there about the looter rich? You know what? I much prefer working with Democrats like Obama and the Clintons, to being under the jackboots of the Republifascist Party.

People who don’t voteyour words are on mute to me. Equality and freedom has never been handed over on a silver platter.  

So KittyburgerYou’re with a group of people and someone lies to them but has helped you.  That makes the liar OK with you?  So if a LGB law was pushed through without transprotection, that’s OK?  

wowThat sounds a lot like when Obama said to GetEqual, “stop yelling at me, go yell at the Republicans, they’re the real problem.”  (not an exact quote)  It was bullshit when he said it, and it’s bullshit now.  If you think kitty’s criticism was off-base in this particular instance, that’s one thing… but we LGBs can be poor allies to trans people at times, and there’s no blanket exemption from criticism about that.

GOProud…hasn’t got much of a point.  The day the Republican party presents itself as a viable alternative for an LGBT rights group to endorse, that’s the day Republicans can complain about HRC’s alignment with the Democratic Party.
That being said, I don’t like the endorsement myself.  I just don’t think partisanship is the problem with it.  We should be part of the Democratic coalition.  We just shouldn’t give away the milk for free.

I didn’t say it was illegitimate. In fact I see where it’s coming from.
I do find it odd that you appear to be defending Joe Solomnese’s choice here.
Do you think he and HRC endorse Obama this early and this enthusiastically because they are grateful for Obama’s work on behalf of the Trans community?
Do you think that was a major part of Joe & HRC’s decision making process?

What don’t you get?

we LGBs can be poor allies to trans people at times

Granted.  Perfectly true, perfectly accurate.  But there is a big difference between calling out some LGBs out when it’s appropriate (and again, it sometimes is) and working like hell to find something offensive about everything any LGB says or does.  If you haven’t noticed that there are some trans people who do that, you haven’t been paying attention.  As I specifically pointed out, they are a small minority of the T community.  But they are definitely out there, and they seem to revel in anti-LGB shrillness.  Calling them out for that is every bit as legitimate as calling out LGBs who actively advocate tossing Ts under the bus for our own advancement.

Well, four GOPers in the New York House Asseembyvoted for marriage equality in 2009. And 8 Senators and 15 House members for DADT repeal.
It’s slim pickings for sure.
But it’s clearly not as hopeless as you say.
And considering it’s pretty much impossible to get ANY BILL through the US Senate with only the votes of one party, for the sake of passing ENDA, we better all hope you are wrong, and the GOP CAN be moved.
Because they are not going anywhere in our lifetime.  

More blunders. A veritable blunderstorm.Blunder – the Supremes are there only to protect the ability of the rich to get richer. While the courts occasionally come down on our side they seem not to have noticed one of the worst pieces of bigotry in US History – Bill Clinton’s DOMA. Of course you wouldn’t consider DOMA  a blunder because you  ” much prefer working with Democrats like Obama and the Clintons”
Blunder – please list your reasons for thinking that we live in a “a right-wing theocracy-thugocracy” – that’s a fantasy and luckily it won’t bring back the 29 million voters who rejected your party’s right wing agenda last fall.
Blunder – Please explain when and where I advocated armed rebellion against the US. Homeland Security will want to know.
Blunder – please explain how you came to the conclusion that the Republicans – who differ little from you Democrats – are a fascist party. That’s flat out science fiction.
The preconditions for fascism are the collapse and failure of capitalist ‘democratic’ government, the collapse or total defeat of unions and the left and growth of a mass fascist movement based on the middle, not the working class.
A key fact about fascists is that they use the phraseology of the left to build the right. The Nazis, the National Socialist German Workers Party or National Sozialistische Deutscher Arbeiter Partei pretended to be for working people but murdered socialists and unionists and then everyone else. Mussolini was a former socialist editor. Do the Republicans fit that mold?
Sorry to bust your bubble but all the rest – racism, militarism, the ‘national security’ state, union busting, misogyny, empire building and anti-GLBT bigotry are just day in and day out standard operating practices of both Democrats and Republicans.
Democrats often try to whip up hysteria and portray Republicans as fascists in an attempt to get people to vote for bigots like Obama. The truth is that both parties share the same right centrist agenda.
Better luck next time.  

Lymis, tell us howthe rampant bigotry of ‘gawd’s in the mix”, the cry that rallied catholic, mormon and baptist bigots to defeat Prop 8 is an ‘moderately pro-gay stand’.
Please explain how Obama’s relationship with fellow bigots like Rick Warren, Josh Dubois, Leah Daughtry, Tim Kaine, and Donnie McClurkin is a ‘moderately pro-gay stand’. Three of them are or were part of his administration or headed up the DNC or him. Two of them crisscross Africa demanding the punishment of LGBT folks. Three of them, like ‘kill the gays’ Jimmy Swaggart. are ordained pentecostal ministers. Are they also people with a ‘moderately pro-gay stand’.
Please explain how his failure to lead the drive to repeal Democrat Bill Clintons DOMA or to pass ENDA, which has been on the back burner since 1994 is a ‘moderately pro-gay stand’. How is the betrayal of his promise or his bigoted opposition to same sex marriage in the least a ‘moderately pro-gay stand’.
Finally, even if it were true that he has a ‘moderately pro-gay stand’ how do you justify four more years of depression, the mass murder of civilians and wasting the lives of GI. Are a few moderate Easter eggs and more moderate crumbs more important than ending the war and taking a swat at the depression.  

Yes, they are.

Are a few moderate Easter eggs and more moderate crumbs more important than ending the war and taking a swat at the depression.

The things Obama has done for LGBT rights are by no means “Easter eggs and moderate crumbs”, and even if they were, “ending the war and taking a swat at the depression” are moot points — your precious anarchism isn’t going to do a goddamn thing to change either of them. You people don’t have the guts to actually start a civil war, much less win one.
I’ll take Obama’s half-hearted progress over your whining pedantry any day.

Where is the like button when I need it?n/t

“I am not interested in picking up crumbs of compassion thrown from the table of someone who considers himself my master. I want the full menu of rights.” Desmond Tutu The war and economic collapse are only ‘moot points’ for people who don’t care about them.
I’m not an anarchist, I’m a leftist, a socialist. Perhaps, when you attended grade school, they didn’t make those distinctions clear. Whatever. You’ll just have to get up to speed on these things.  
‘Start a civil war’? Less hysteria and more politics are in order.
As soon as the AFL-CIO unleashes our Labor Party it’ll begin the fights to end unemployment and get homes for people stuck in Obamavilles, to take back the trillions Bush and his cousin Obama gave to the rich, to end the Clinton-Bush-Obama wars and their use of kidnapping, torture and murder, to call for an International War Crimes Tribunal, to repeal Clinton’s DOMA, NAFTA and deregulation of predatory banks, and to pass a comprehensive ENDA/CRA.
That’s just for starters. Then we’ll get radical.  
You can have Obama, and be my guest, feast on crumbs. Most of us want equality.  

They’ve never been won in a voting booth. They’re won by mass action.  

Question for youCan your mind be changed about any of the following?
Christians, Republicans, or Democrats?
I ask not to get into any fights — this is pure curiosity on my part.
I’ve asked variants of this question off and on in the past of many people.

As a note…I have no clue what Kitty is or was thinking on this part, but, based on her posts, strictly, the questions you are asking her are dismissive of the problem she stated.
Specifically: she stated that the issue is with the cis-GL establishment.  On the presumption that she’s using the same basic model that so many are these days(which is really primarily directed at the HRC for reasons that underlie your finding it odd, but tossing in old transgressions by other major groups, to include pretty much any major GLB group out there, since none of them have clean hands, regardless of what they may have done since, since the underlying issue is still present, to wit: ENDA), then logically that would include the HRC, and, therefore, could not have been something she thought was involved.
I’m pretty sure I’ve helped make this clear in the past: the HRC is considered an enemy of trans people by most of the trans population. Not merely an opponent, but an actual enemy, despite the work they’ve been attempting to do, because they have actively engaged in efforts which aligned them with the folks at Family Research Council and Traditional Values Coalition — efforts which specifically dealt in issues dealing with trans people.
This is important, because in the trans community, the HRC is that far down.  Think about how the greater “LGBT” community would react if the TVC suddenly tried to do something good for us. And if you think its positive, well, you have some illusions about people.
So your asking those two questions essentially has the impact of silencing her by ignoring what she was talking about in the first place, and then, as a result, essentially doing what she says cisLGB folks do.
None of which is meant as disrespect to you, Clarknt67, but merely as observation with the slim hope of pointing out a problem that consistently escapes people.
As to why no issue cannot be “twisted” (a word choice which I find offensive, but eh), the simple truth is that just as there is no issue out there that does not affect the LGB communities, there is no issue out there doesn’t affect the T communities, inclusive of the issues around sexual orientation.
This is why the use of the term “cis-LGB” — there are transLGB and interLGB people as well, and they are often ignored because of the perpetuation of cissexism on the part of the cis community as a whole (to which the cisGLB community belongs as a part, separated by their sexual orientation).
whew
damn, ain’t all this oppression olympics stuff fun?

Excellent questionHowever, the overall sentiment is expressed at any sort of institutional element, since the issues being dealt with here are institutional oppression.
I’ve tried to get a consensus on what this really means, but, generally speaking, the only element to be consistent in such surveying is the HRC.
The mistake in 2007 is still unapologized for.  And allof this is the silver lining to it: it caused the trans community to stand up for itself more loudly and more vociferously than ever before.
It literally was the last straw, the breaking point.
Watching the history while living within it is very interesting.

Its institutionalNot personal.
You asked why, and that’s why. Not that you’ll hear me on that, but I figured I’d give you an answer.
(And, seriously, I know I’m not one of your fave peeps and all, but “pathology”?  Really?  When talking about trans people?  Did you mean to throw gasoline on a fire or were you just doing it by accident? Oi, QScribe, oi!)

Decent pointHowever, think on this real quick, using your example as the basis:
You have one person who has helped your tribe and a group of people who have not only lied but actively sought to harm your tribe.
The group that has harmed your tribe says they support the individual who has helped your tribe.
The tribes that group represents say they don’t like it when people support this one man, because he’s lied to them and continued things that hurt them.
That’s a more accurate description of the situation, and the best thing all the tribes could do is to say fuck both the group and the individual.
Both are liars and both have caused harm.  Let’s get someone who does neither.
Only to find out that the other options will harm everyone to a greater extent, at which point some of all the tribes will say “well, they can’t be that bad — devil you know and all that”.
Which can then be said about the current situation, and, thusly, you have a stalemate with a lot of bitterness.
Sound familiar?

My mind can be changed by facts but not by fantasies. There are no facts that make me believe that the Democrat/Republican party can ever conceivably be a  vehicle to win equality, a viable environment, decent wages, or that they’ll ever want to end the wars, unemployment, homelessness, racism, bigotry and woman hating that are at the core of their politics. Both wings of the Republican/Democrat party are not internally democratic and are owned, lock, stock and barrel by the rich.  Chicago 1968 is an example of what happens when people tried to take the Democrat Party away from the rich.  
The only opinion I have about most Democrat and Republican voters is that very soon after they’re given an alternative they’ll bolt from both right wing parties. Already about one third of the eligible electorate refuse to vote. They’re the smart ones. Who can blame them if they refuse to choose the lesser bigot, the lesser lap dog of the rich, the lesser warmonger.
I don’t have opinions about most individual christers except to advocate offering them medical help to end their addiction-dependence on fantasies.  
As for the anti-GLBT, child molesting clergy who conspire to spread HIV-AIDS, promote state lynching and deny us basic rights, I think their actions in those cases should be criminalized.
You didn’t ask but I have the same general approach to religious judaists, islamists and other ists and ites. (Except for believers in Thor. I actually saw him in 3-D and understand how people could worship that.)

Thank you.

Not one of my favorite “peeps”?Darling, I’ve never heard of you.
The original comment I find objectionable was most definitely not “institutional.”  It was specifically sniping at a specific commenter.
And yes, an insistence that I, ME, MINE, GIMME! has to be mentioned in every single post, whether it’s relevant or not, is pathological.  And yes, there, there are T people with pathological issues.  How many times do I have to repeat that I’m talking about a small minority of the T community?  
Every time I read comments like the ones in this thread, I find myself thinking of a line from The Lion in Winter:

How often do you  people have to hear it? Shall we start the soup with who we love and who we don’t?

You’re welcome.

You people? Like socialist, anrocho-feminists or what?In 1774 there was a man, a whining pedant, who nagged incessantly for independence.
His name?
John Adams
By your standards, Emma Goldman was a whining pedant
As was Thomas Jefferson

If we are part of the Democratic coalitionwe are telling that hanging out with Mclurkin and Warren is fine, that “one man and one woman” because the Bible tells him so is fine, that we are willing to wait til it is a confortable time for him to graciously hand us our rights because there is “Change you can believe in”
Overt action obtained for us whatever we’ve accomplished such as DADT
Otherwise, there are just the things like the Rental Truck Equality Memo, limited to a few and erased just as easily as LGBT rights in Tennessee

“…a small minority of the T community”One of the more interesting things I’ve been finding is that one of the only things that the various ideological branches that exist among TG/TS people seem to have in common is a general apathy (at best) for the history of the LGB and T. The reasoning may be different, but the sentiment is the same.

You have.Just under a different nom de plume.
Dyssonance is what I used to write under.
As to why it has to be mentioned in every single post, well, a large part of the reason is that it is consistently ignored and overlooked, and serves as a note that yes, it has broader implications.