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My earlier post on ABC’s experiment about discrimination against Muslims went live a bit ago, but then I found this horrific video from last night’s AC360 (Dr. Sanjay Gupta hosting), with homobigot and Islamophobe Bryan Fischer of American Family Radio Talk Network (one of the arms of Don and Tim Wildmon of the American Family Association), who really pares it down to the basics — “No More Mosques, Period.” You have to see it to believe it. Remember, this is the same man endlessly spouts homophobic crap. But he’s versatile — there’s always someone else on the list for these people to persecute.
We’re joined now via Skype by Bryan Fischer; he’s the host of Focal Point on the American Family Radio Talk Network. . We should point out that he’s also issues director for the American Family Association. While he says his views are his own, not the association’s, the American Family Radio Network is, in fact, listed as a division of the AFA, just to get that all clear. Thanks for joining us, Mr. Fischer.BRYAN FISCHER, HOST, “FOCAL POINT” AMERICAN FAMILY RADIO TALK NETWORK: You’re welcome, Dr. Gupta, good to be with you.
GUPTA: Thank you. I want to be clear on your viewpoint here because you’ve made quite a bit of waves lately. You don’t want any mosques built in the United States, is that correct? You want a moratorium?
FISCHER: I think the reality Dr. Gupta is, that when we look at Islam, we’re looking at a totalitarian ideology that is anti-Christian, anti-Semitic. The values that are at the core of Islam are contrary to every single solitary western and American value. I think communities ought to have the liberty to reject building permits.
Each one of these mosques is either a potential or actual recruitment center for Jihadism or training center for Jihadism.
GUPTA: You said quite a bit there already. Let me just start with one thing, freedom of religion. You’ve been asked this question before; it’s one of this country’s founding principles.The First Amendment says, Congress shall make no law respecting (ph) an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof.
How can you say that that potentially applies to all religions except Islam?
FISCHER: Well, the reality, Dr. Gupta, is that no one could claim First Amendment religious protections if their ideology and their activities are subversive.
All you’ve got do is ask the Christian militia, the Hutaree how much First Amendment protections they had when they set out to attack federal officers. They have Bible verses plastered all over their Web site. Everything they did, they did in the name of Jesus Christ. They are right now pondering the limits of the First Amendment from the inside of a jail cell, which is where they should be.
The deranged Fischer continues below the fold.I don’t know how Gupta held it together.
GUPTA: You know, you have said — now, again, you’ve said some this before. Your evidence for saying that every mosque potentially here is dedicated to the overthrowing of the American government is a manifest, I believe, issued in 1991 by a group called the Muslim Brotherhood. Now, you quote some frightening passages from there about destroying Western civilization from within.But, Bryan, you realize this group doesn’t speak for all Muslims; it doesn’t speak for all Muslims around the world. It doesn’t speak for all Muslims in the United States. It’s a radical political group, very controversial.
And while its history does involve some violence, they’re — they’re controversial even among Muslims. So, how can you — how can you use that one particular organization and say that they’re speaking for 1.2 billion people?
FISCHER: Well, Dr. Gupta, it’s nice of you to try to marginalize the Muslim Brotherhood, but their tentacles include the Islamic Society of North America, the Muslim Student Association, the Council for American-Islamic Relations — CAIR, and also the Muslim Association.
So, you’re looking at four — five, really, if you include the Brotherhood — five of the most prominent and most visible Muslim organizations in North America. They are far from a fringe group; they represent the essence and the core of Islam. And it’s very clear that the goal of Islam in North America is the extermination of Western civilization. No community should have to put up with that.
GUPTA: I don’t think a lot of people agree with you, Bryan, on this. I just have to say that. And I’m a layperson when it comes to this, but let me ask you what you think of this particular comment back in 2001.“Islam is peace.” Now, that wasn’t said by any liberal or Democrat. It was said by President George W. Bush, a man who talked at length about his deep Christian faith. What about that from President Bush?
FISCHER: Well, President Bush was well-meaning, but wrong.
Islam is not a religion of peace. It is a religion of war. It is a religion of violence. Christianity, on the other hand, is a religion of peace. It was founded by the Prince of Peace. That’s the major contrast between the two religions.
Islam, in reality, is a political ideology. It’s a totalitarian political ideology. And you simply cannot hide a totalitarian political agenda behind the First Amendment.
Imagine if Timothy McVeigh was a Christian. Now, he wasn’t. He was an atheist. But imagine he was a part of a violent Christian sect, and he wanted to build a 13-story center, cultural center, for his Christian sect overlooking the grounds of the Murrah Building in Oklahoma City.
GUPTA: All right.
FISCHER: I don’t think anybody in America would put up with that, and they would be right not to.
GUPTA: I hear you. I think that’s an unfair comparison, with all due respect.
Quickly, Mr. Fischer, a lot of Muslim-Americans watching tonight, some of them very upset by some of the comments you have made in the past, what do you say to them now?
FISCHER: Well, I say I love Muslims. I am pro-Muslim. I am anti-Islam.
I would say to a Muslim, look, your ideology is destructive. It’s deceptive. It’s dark. I invite you to come into the light of the kingdom of Jesus Christ. That’s where hope and light, forgiveness and a promise for the future can truly be found.
GUPTA: Well, I — it’s been an interesting interview — you love Muslims; you hate Islam.Bryan Fischer, we will — we will keep — we will keep tabs on you and see how things are going. Thanks so much for joining us.
FISCHER: Thank you, Dr. Gupta.
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Well, Bryan Fischershould know what a “totalitarian political ideology” looks like, considering what he’s expressing here. I’m glad Dr. Gupta put this guy on and let him show his totalivangelical a$$ to the nation.
Of course, this interview will change nothing for those who support demagogues like Fischer. Willful ignorance is a scary thing.
The irony of course…The people that he is railing against are the political/religious equivalent of him, just under a different deity to subjugate people under. It’s a competition thing.
Does it seem like these groups with the word “family” in the name are, for lack of a better word, inbred? They all seem to have the same few hardcore *-phobes leading them but want to look like they have a huge base across the country.
Actually no.When the rest of us listen to him, we are willing to parse things and agree in principle that IF someone uses Islam (and, we would add, any other religion or creed) to do things that are violent, anti-freedom, destructive, and so on, that those particular individuals should be dealt with.
The people WE would sanction are the politicized Islamic equivalent of him.
But the people HE is railing against are anyone who is Islamic, comes from an Islamic background, isn’t Islamic but comes from a majority Islamic culture, or just looks like they might be. He is railing against a whole lot of people who AREN’T the equivalent of him, but hardworking, tolerant, American citizens expecting the same rights as everyone else.
The tragedy is that he knows that people will agree with language about destructive, violent, Anti-American extremists, and that there is an audience willing to paint everyone in an unfamiliar group with the same broad brush.
In Support of the Muslim American CommunityHere is a snippet from a note I wrote in support of the Muslim American Community:
In the note, I name my Muslim American and liberal Muslim friends from around the world and thank them for contributing to freedom and equality. I wanted to give a face to the Muslim American community to counter these hateful depictions of my peace loving friends. I ask others to share the note and name their Muslim American friends.
Here is the full note: In Support of the Muslim American Community
George Byrd, Columbus, OH
Let’s Make a DealLet’s make a deal: No mosques, in exchange for no churches.
It sounds like a win-win to me.
Especially no Cahtolic churches near playgrounds!as the DAILY SHOW reminds us. And NEVER NEVER churches on opposite corners! or all four…as in most Southern towns and cities. But really, he does realize as KO stated that there has been an active Mosque w/n one block of the WTC… for 40 years! Since before the WTC was even built!!…and it is a community center, they want to build.
“I love Muslims, I’m Anti-Islam”…Sounds an AWFUL lot like “I love gays, I hate homosexuality” to me.
Pam…I have a question for you…
While you are quite right to cover this rempant anti-muslim behaviour on the right, how come you have not spent much time questioning why the LGBT Community’s premier publication of record, The Advocate, is giving a someone like Michael Lucas a public platform for spewing equally vicious islamophobic hatred?
That should be more of an issue for you and the LGBT community given that this is the same commuity that is demanding equality and support from the American public. This guy was atleast challenged on his positions on CNN. Michael Lucas is spewing his hate unopposed in The Advocate.
Michael Lucas cinematic legend is based on such masterpieces as ‘FART’ and ‘PISS’. He exposes young men to HIV/AIDS by filming unsafe sex.
Aside from that Lucas is chiefly known as a racist who hates all Arabs and muslims and approves of the murder of Palestinian children by IDF thugs.
The intersection of islamophobic racism and homophobic hatred is always occupied by fundamentalist zionists, teabaggers, panderers of both parties and christer theocrats. (And in Lucas’ case by internalized hatred.)
On FreedomI can’t believe we’re still living in such an ignorant culture. If you have paid any attention to the news, you will know the hot topic right now, even bigger than gay marriage, is the issue of the building of a mosque in NYC. Too many of us are willing to defend the freedom of speech, freedom of religion, or countless other Constitutional rights, until someone comes along we strongly disagree with. I have personally been the victim of extensive homophobia almost exclusively by those claiming to be Christian, yet I can easily draw the distinction between a bigoted fundie and a good Christian. Even further, I believe in the rights of religious individuals to believe and speak their beliefs, even if those statements include the belief that homosexuality is sin and that I’m going to burn in Hell for being gay.
Muslims creating a place of worship, even if it is at ground zero, is within their rights, and if we deny their rights, you’d better not complain if we start denying the rights of Christians or anyone else to practice their religion. The 9/11 attacks represent Muslims just as much as Fred Phelps represents Christians. Or to be more precise, neither one represents the larger community, and I would argue that Al Qaeda isn’t even truly Muslim anymore than Phelps is a good Christian, what with his constant “God Hates Fags” protests. That is me expressing my freedom to believe what I wish, and to speak my beliefs.
There are extremes that pop up among any group, even liberal ones. Us gays have the “Bash Back” organization that actively promotes violence against homophobic individuals and groups. PETA members have been known to bomb scientific labs, resulting in the deaths of people working toward medicine. And how many self-proclaimed Christians have killed abortion doctors in the name of their Lord? No community is immune – every one has its fringe extremists, and it’s extremely unfair to judge an entire community and deny that community’s rights based on the actions of its fringe “members.” It’s not just unfair, it’s unconstitutional.
If you value your own rights and freedoms, protect those of others, even if you don’t agree with them. At the very least, don’t actively project discrimination and interfere with the rights of others! And please get educated about these issues – stop following the crowd and show you actually have critical thinking skills! Maybe consider reading some of the Qur’an and see that it’s just as peaceful and just as violent as the Bible. Or take the opportunity to speak to someone who is Muslim to gain insight about their beliefs. I think it’s absolutely preposterous to believe that the Muslims constructing the mosque in NYC have anything to do with terrorism or the 9/11 attacks. I have educated myself about Christianity, I know the Bible well, and many of my friends are Christians – to some degree I even consider myself Christian. Despite the homophobia I’ve faced, I don’t look at every Christian and assume they’re homophobic. And even if they are, they have a right to be homophobic and speak their beliefs as long as it doesn’t turn into active harassment, which is not protected speech (i.e.; stalking, attacking an individual, etc.).
If we take away another person’s rights, we will all lose them. Even more profound, we each become less free. I know if I lived in NYC, I’d love to visit the mosque – it sounds like it’s going to turn out to be a really beautiful community center that will benefit everyone. We should be grateful for the opportunity to support the foundation of our country, and more than anyone else, New Yorkers should understand the value of liberty – after all, they’ve got a giant statue in their backyard, reminding them of it every day, though I bet few Americans have taken the time to understand her deep symbolism – the 7 spires on her crown, the book in her hand, and the burning torch. We will never forget September 11th, but I fear we have already forgotten September 17th. If this mosque has no right to stand in New York, then neither does Lady Liberty.