Pastor Rick Warren attempts to straddle a volatile issue — Uganda’s legislation that calls for the execution of gays — and commits a double twist, backflip FAIL by saying “As a pastor, my job is to encourage, to support. I never take sides.”
Timothy Kincaid at Box Turtle Bulletin:
Warren is not hesitant to interfere in international religious divisions or schisms. Though not Anglican, he has been a major player in providing American support to African Anglicans who are seeking to oust any affiliates from the Anglican Communion that make any accommodation for gay Christians.…[He]‘s no stranger to activism on behalf of legislation. Though he was not highly visible in supporting Proposition 8, he did not hesitate to instruct his flock – which does not stop at the walls of his church – to vote to take away the civil rights of their gay neighbors.
But Warren has now found the one exception to his political involvement. And that exception is the proposed Ugandan “Kill Gays” bill. Unlike virtually anything else that flickers across his attention, this piece of legislation just doesn’t rise to the level of requiring his involvement. That would be “interfering in the political process of other nations.”
Or maybe Rick Warren just doesn’t find it unethical on the part of leadership in Uganda to execute HIV positive gay people, incarcerate the rest for life, ban any form of activism that might object, and jail those family, friends, or acquaintances who fail to report their gay loved ones to the government.
Yes, let’s go to the videotape…
Warren’s moral judgment here only points out that hypocrisy knows no bounds — and this is the man who Barack Obama invited to deliver the invocation at his inauguration. Pillar of loving Christianity, Rick Warren. Does the White House have any comment about this? Will someone ask Robert “I know nothing” Gibbs at the daily presser?
Oh wait — the Obama administration has taken a position — it agrees with Rick Warren!
And is it a coincidence that the Obama administration — in which Warren has a fan at the very top — has not spoken out loudly enough against what’s happening in Uganda and that the man who doles out the AIDS dollars (our taxpayer dollars, need I remind) on behalf of the president to Uganda, PEPFAR chief Eric Goosby, says pretty much what Warren says? According to Newsweek.com, Goosby says his job is “not to tell a country how to put forward their legislation.”
Wow. Just. Wow.
***
Truth Wins Out calls for Secretary of State Hillary Clinton to hold a hearing on PEPFAR funding to demand strict human rights, patient confidentiality and free speech controls are tied to PEPFAR aid, particularly since Goosby is not concerned.
Goosby appears to be both ignorant of HIV/AIDS in Uganda, and determined to use taxpayer dollars to undermine the very same education programs that PEPFAR was created to support:1. HIV/AIDS in Uganda is primarily a heterosexual phenomenon; Goosby falsely contends that it is a homosexual phenomenon that threatens the “general population.”
2. The Anti-Homosexuality Bill would criminalize key aspects of comprehensive HIV/AIDS prevention education and imprison health-care workers who refuse to report sexually active gay patients to the police.Goosby’s use of federal funds to subsidize the punishment of HIV/AIDS education and health-care workers, and to push LGBT Ugandans deep underground, is inexcusable. And the silence of U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, regarding her subordinates’ support for violence in Uganda, is unacceptable.



52 Comments





The The Family is backing this law too:
http://shakespearessister.blog…
http://rawstory.com/2009/11/au…
What a disgusting bunch of shits; and yes, I include Goosby and Obama there.
Genocide is what the Ugandian anti-gay lawcalls for. Period.
This is a moral failure of great proportions by both Warren and the Obama Administration.
Definition of genocidethe deliberate and systematic destruction of a racial, political, or cultural group.
http://www.merriam-webster.com…
So my choice of that word is not too strong AT ALL.
This will be a nasty hot potato issue…To speak out against the Uganda law would counter anti-gay organizations’ attempts at vilifying LGB people. However, how can any political organization built upon a supposed “pro-family” platform hope to survive while simultaneously approving of genocide? In other words, what do you do when you finally get what you want, and it’s not what you expected?
I’m kind of looking forward to watching them squirm, if reporters decide to hold their feet to the fire.
I didn’t need to gag like that this early in the a.m.This guy is horrid his “values” are not something that sane societies allow to fester. The fact that he has O’s ear makes me want to seek asylum before they put us in camps.
I would be very surprised if the Obama administration has anything at all to sayEither about the proposed law in Uganda, Warren’s alleged neutrality or the genocide that will follow if the law is passed.
While he has tried to straddle the fence, Obama has made it very plain that he sides with the bigots. The death penalty for homosexuals is the logical end of what the bigots have been preaching for decades. Warren et al. cannot openly support it, but they will not shed any tears once gay people start being rounded up and led to the gas chambers (the choice of allusion is deliberate.)
I do not see the Obama administration doing anything more than tut-tutting and asking for more campaign funding because “we are better than the Republicans.”
He’ll try to find “common ground” with them, as he has done with every other villain in sight. Of course, “common ground” with these fiends would probably mean castrating or lobotomizing gays and then executing them. But hey, he’s our fierce advocate, so how can we squawk? And look on the bright side: the castrations and lobotomies might be covered under a public option.
No Stance?What?? No pro-life stance by Warren…..?
Warrenonly a seasoned bullshitter would attempt to take a stand like Warren’s latest.
Warren is very well spicedAfter all, bullshitting is what he does for a living.
CA Prime Minister Stephen Harpertook Ugandan President Yoweri Museveni to task about the gay execution bill this weekend at the Commonwealth summit in Trinidad and Tobago.
As I recall, Brown was recently buttering up the LGBT in advance of elections. I think he’s going to have to do more than mildly “express concern” over this bill if he wants LGBT people and human rights allies to take him at all seriously.
full story
In Canada, apparently they move in the opposite direction…Leaders in the US usually move to the right (even the GOP), but in Canada they seem to move left. Harper put some weight behind attempts at repealing marriage equality a while ago, but now he’s seriously going to bat for the GLBT community, even if it’s in private.
Surreal.
DAMN! Even Tory Harper spoke in our favor??!!Well, it’s good to at least see other world leaders take the Ugandan government to task over the proposed “kill teh gayz!!!!” bill. Just 5 years ago Harper wanted to repeal Canada’s recently enacted marriage equality law, but it seems he’s come around to accepting LGBT equality. Gordon Brown’s been a mostly consistent friend in Britain (except he still hasn’t yet announced support for upgrading civil partnerships to real marriage equality), so I’m glad he’s also speaking against this atrocity.
I hope the rest of the Commonwealth countries speak up soon… And hopefully force our own “President Fierce Advocate” to speak up as well.
Rick Warren = homophobic @ssSimple as that. He doesn’t want us happily married. He successfully “rick-rolled” Melissa Etheridge into looking like a fool while defending him. He got Obama to (once again) throw us under the bus to hop on “The Holy Roller Unity Express”. He won’t do ANYTHING to actually help people, especially LGBTQ people.
In fact, I wouldn’t be surprised if the sick f*cktard is privately cheering this on… Especially since the homophobe Ugandan PM is one of “Krispy Kreme Ricky’s” BFFs.
Laws against ChristianityI would bet Mr. Warren would take sides pretty damn quickly if there were laws calling for the execution of Christians – say in a Muslim country (in fact, I bet there are, and I bet he has spoken out against them). Proving once again that the minute someone screams how “Christian” they are, the more likely I am to consider them total frauds.
As an aside Pam, I really wonder why you call this man “Pastor”? He is not the head of your church, so he is not your pastor. I think we all make this mistake, and it is time to stop. These people are not some exalted class, no matter how much they might wish, and only the members of their churches should be required to treat them with deference. Warren and I, and you and everyone else, are all equal citizens of this country, and must be considered as such before the law. Mr. Warren is sufficient, and quite frankly more than he deserves.
warren facebook twitterI wonder how many of his sheep are also for genocide – ask them
http://www.facebook.com/pages/…
http://twitter.com/RickWarren
How long before this happens in America?American christians were the impetus for this law. What’s stopping them from attempting to enact something similar here? Before anyone accuses me of knee-jerk hysteria, consider something important:
The rightwingers have been calling for the reinstatement of anti-sodomy laws ever since Lawrence was decided. They subject us to vicious smear campaigns in every state, whether it’s marriage or anti-discrimination laws. The sole object of these campaigns is to dehumanize us and gin up violence against us. We saw what happened as a result of the Yes on 8 campaign (opens as .pdf). This shit doesn’t happen in a vacuum.
The rightwingers are gaining more followers every day, and they are going deeper and deeper into the abyss of their hatred and violence. Remember, in Germany it began with the Nuremberg laws, which prohibited marriage between non-Aryans (Jews) and Germans, and which stripped Jewish Germans of their citizenship, downgrading them from “citizen” to “national.” We see the same laws here against LGBT people, driven by Christians, deliberately stripping us of our rights to family and military service. Attempts to grant us equal protection in housing, employment, education, lending, and health care are painted as assaults on “religious liberty.” There has been an annual rise in anti-gay and anti-trans hate crimes every year since 2004. We see such hate crimes against us go overlooked, unreported and underreported. Our attempts at equal protection are laughed out of court; every SCOTUS case dismissal or refusal this year has been at the urging of this Administration.
It wasn’t a far cry from the Nuremberg laws to the camps for either the Jews or the gays in Nazi Germany. Mike Huckabee previously called for gay men with HIV/AIDS to be put in detention camps, the same type of action the Ugandan government is calling for! The Catholic church is declaring anti-gay lobbying as one of its top two priorities (with abortion being the other one). Make no mistake, pretty soon there will be a move for this same thing to happen here in America.
The fact that the Obama Administration – the same Administration which signed on to the U.N. declaration calling for the decriminalization of homosexuality worldwide – has said nothing at any level, in any capacity, in response to this horror, is terrifying. Especially when the BFF Inaugural Pastor supports this law, and was in fact one of the main players laying the groundwork for it. These people run this country; you cannot deny that. And they are just itching for a chance to do the same here.
This is in the worst of Christian traditions…… turning a blind eye to human rights abuses committed by government.
Sorry, Rev., but as a Christian it is your duty to take a position and to speak out against laws and practices which oppress other humans. What next, Rick Warren? Will you shrug your shoulders when confronted with torture?
Nope, your use of the word is spot on.The question isn’t “are they killing us?” We know that question, the answer is yes, not just in Uganda, but here.
The question is “when are we going to make them stop?”, and “How?”
God to Rick: “Don’t Kill”http://www.theonion.com/conten…
It IS terrifyingas well as a deafening silence.
EXACTLY.If there were such news (Uganda calling for slaughtering of all Christians), can’t you just see the screaming by media?
Riots, protests, people with pitchforks and torches?
The White House, loudly denouncing and demanding an immediate end?
Emergency UN meeting, sanctions, outcries from other nations?
But, no- “Move along people, NOTHING TO SEE HERE!!!”
PerhapsI’m not convinced. Yes, most Americans do oppose full equality, but that appears to be something of a generational thing, with the old more against, and the young more supportive. And compared to what 10 years ago, 5 years ago, the numbers in support of full equality appear to be increasing, even if (very) slowly. So, if the window for the bigots to get their agenda into place is closing. I’m not saying that people should get complacent, mind.
I also don’t agree that it is terrifying that the Obama admin hasn’t said anything, just because his admin signed onto the non-binding UN declaration. Fair or not, unpleasant though it is, Uganda doesn’t matter much to most people. It isn’t as if other countries that signed onto the UN declaration too are saying much of anything about Uganda.
Furthermore, again, unpleasant though it is, nation states are not moral, ethical actors. The Obama admin will say something if it believes that it is in the US’ foreign interests, and it’s own domestic political interests, to do so. Human rights are a realpolitikal figleaf.
These people do NOT run the US. If they did, LGBTs would already be in camps and jails.
The majority of Christians in the USnot only shrug their shoulders when confronted with torture, but start cheering.
IIRC, a recent Pew poll showed that more Christians support torture than average, whereas atheists least supported torture
BIG HUGS, KeoriCheck your emails hon and know we love you…
No but it puts American moral authoritybehind that signature.
I’m sorry, when a genocide is involved, the least a President can do is speak out. Especially when it’s a black president and it involves Africa. And it involves white colonialism too.
The black Christian homobigots at huff postare shrugging their shoulders as well. They are either defending Rick Warren or trying to derail it into a gay marriage conversation.
So as far as I am concerned, they are defending a sort of white colonialism (heck, it’s not even a sort of)
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/…
You said…
The reality is those African nations are so far behind on human rights that most people see this as just “another” problem. The question is, at what point does it stop being a Third World problem when some pretty powerful people in America are involved?… That’s the question most don’t want to answer.
Ricky = the pontius pilate 2.0Wash your f*ckin’ hands on a sweet Christmas special of the Uganda’s men’s and women’s blood.
WHY I can’t envision a world where we are all welcome.
I feel an image of the 3 Magi (Rick Warren, Bishop Torbin, and Thomas Monson)Mary and the baby run away in HORROR.
I not going quietly to NO CAMPAnd f*cking with someone 25 years with a terminal disease SERIOUSLY ain’t a good idea.
Sadly, you are also partly rightWhile in Copenhagen, Canadian PM Harper slammed on Uganda for this atrocity, and Harper is a rightwinger who tried to have Canada’s marriage laws repealed.
And he and Gordon Brown have been the only top officials willing to make a even a semi-public statement (that I can find at this moment).
These people do NOT run the US. If they did, LGBTs would already be in camps and jails.
I’ll just let kevinchi and petey explain to you the conditions in which gay men with AIDS lived out their last horrific, agony-filled days back when Reagan was willing to let AIDS do the gay extermination work for him. Bear in mind that far too many LGBT seniors currently live in similar conditions in hospice, ripped away from their partners by bigoted facility policies and family members, closeted due to fear of harassment from other residents and staff. And if you think a lot of people don’t want those idyllic days of St. Ronnie back, you’re not paying attention.
It’s what they wantMake no mistake, pretty soon there will be a move for this same thing to happen here in America.
There can’t be any doubt that it’s what they want. Not when they frame your safety as an attack on them.
And that he can claim it as a neutral position to not to judge what amounts to a program of extermination; while claiming to love its victims. He and his kind are a force of true evil. And for far too long, they’ve been allowed to monpolise the speech about morals.
Thanks for the link to the Prop 8 infoI’m sending it to my family members- who all voted Yes on 8 and with whom I’ve had no contact.
And yes, they are members of saddleback church
Hillary Clintonfor the win!
Hillary Condemns International HomophobiaNow if she could get her BOSS to be as fierce an advocate!
Her full statement here.
The USA apparently isn’t part of “the world”The Advocate article you linked to above quotes her as saying:
“We have to stand against any efforts to marginalize and criminalize and penalize members of the LGBT community worldwide.”
Since the “we” she is referring to are not doing so in the United States itself, I can only conclude that the United States is no longer located on Earth. Are we on Kolob now?
Good start. Not enough.We also need to hear pronouncements of condemnation from POTUS, VP Biden, Speaker Pelosi, and the chairs of the RNC and DNC against this, ESPECIALLY those in the United States, in The Family, who helped foment such legislation. The silence is absolutely unacceptable.
If the tables were turned, and it were christians under an extermination order, there would be national outrage. But hey, here it’s just a bunch of whiny fags upset that they haven’t gotten their pony yet. And besides, Obama’s BFF was an architect of this law, so it must be okay, right? Right?
That was some pretty fucking weak teaThe death penalty and life imprisonment is a bit more than just discrimination or marginalization. Marginalization is not being welcome in certain churches. The death penalty is a government-approved extermination order.
Oh please…You’re not going to compare the struggle for marriage equality with what the Ugandan LGBT community faces, are you?? That’s almost a child’s play compared to the real genocide this bill proposes… let’s not confuse things, OK?
she actually said“marginalize and criminalize and penalize members of the LGBT community”. She chosed the right words given the context and the fact that she’s including ALL African countries that jail and execute LGBT’s.
GeeLet’s vote hunh? That’ll work, right?
It’s warThey have no problem killing us over there, and it’s not a stretch to imagine them killing us over here.
Oh please, yourself. I never equated marriage with the proposed Ugandan exterminationDon’t lecture me about “real” genocide. You can kill someone by executing them sure, but you can also kill them by being complicit in the withholding of employment and the health insurance that comes with it by not working to pass the employment non-discrimination act. You can kill them by not including same-sex spouses in your spanky new health care bill. You can kill them by not allowing them open contact with and the support of their same-sex partners and families while serving in the military. You can kill them by making sure they know they’re less of a human being than you are and your “God” says so to boot, then tell them that their increased incidence of suicide is proof of their unworthiness.
And I don’t have to to know that the Obama administration is weak as pee on anything having to do with “stand[ing] against any efforts to marginalize and criminalize and penalize members of the LGBT community”. Show me one proactive thing the Obama administration has done to meaningfully address the spirit of Clinton’s remark.
Push Congress to repeal DADT? Nope!
Push congress to pass ENDA? Nope!
Push Congress to repeal DOMA? Nope!
Defend DOMA while calling it unconstitutional? Yep!
So far all Obama did was sign a defense spending bill with a hate crimes law rider that he never moved a muscle to make happen.
And no one will stop them until it is too lateThe indifference of good men…
I know about Harper and BrownI wasn’t clear on what I meant.
Brown and Harper were mildly rebuking Museveni in the context of the Commonwealth summit in Trinidad. Obama wasn’t there.
Of course they want those idyllic days of Reagan back. In fact, they want more. My point is that they aren’t getting those days back.
Well, my view is that most of the thingsthat people see as just “another 3rd world problem” aren’t. Since in many cases, there is (lots of) US / French / British meddling and involvement.
Maybe I should have made it clear that I don’t agree that nation states should be guided by realpolitiks in international relations.
Where is the South African government in all this?As lead nation in Africa you must ask why is South Africa not speaking out against Uganda. Why are they not bringing this up at the African Union meetings and threatening Uganda with expulsion.
Just like with Zimbabwe, South Africa continues to shirk its position as lead African nation when it really matters.
I guess I should have been clearerI agree with you.
My point is that unfortunately, most politicians don’t agree with either of us.
So now it’s out on the table……and we’re finally hearing, once and for all, what the Religious Right’s agenda for all of us amounts to.
For a while now, I’ve been making comparisons between the Religious Right and the Nazis. Godwin always gets invoked, shutting down any discussion about it. It’s not particularly gratifying to be able to stand up and say ‘I told you so’. But here we have it, an open declaration of war against us, complete with a Bye-Bull inspired ‘Final Solution’. It would surprise me not if their chosen execution method involved lots of pebbles.
So how much longer will it be before it spreads to this continent too? Where are the moderate christians? Are they going to be like the enabling villagers near the death camps, who know what’s going on yet do nothing?
Fuck Godwin. Remember Santayana.
To Rick Warren…Thou shalt not kill. And if you do, you go to hell. Your bible, dearie.