It is a shallow, symbolic gesturewith Congress absent and with the distinct possibility that media coverage could be pre-empted by a comparable but less well behaved protest from the Radical Reactionary Right elsewhere.
It will in the end change no minds or hearts, it will not intimidate our enemies.
Local protests, particularly hit and run ones designed to inconvienience the Right would be far more effective, and in fact would in their ocal areas do much to mobilise and motivate the LGBT community,  

I’ve been uncomfortable with this march from the beginning.I’ve seen very little to convince me that it’s anything more than a feel good trip. Our time and resources are better spent on things like the fight in Maine.

The consensus of many statewide equality organizations is that this march is not best use of scarce resources at this time.  With possible repeal marriage equality in Maine on the ballot, the transgender rights bill under consideration in Massachusetts, as well as the hate crimes bill and ENDA already introduced in Congress, many believe that the march will not be productive in advancing the GLBT rights and will siphon money and people that could be used elsewhere.  I will not be participating but will continue doing what I can to work for equality at home.

Why all the negativity?I think those who do not support the march are short-sighted. First of all, you never can tell what is going to happen, and I mean down to the personal level for the individuals who participate; new connections and friendships can be forged, life is organic and a stew always produces something new. Secondly, an event like this is a great opportunity to participate for many people. I have friends who are not particularly politically active, who are flying across the country to be there. I am driving 350 miles each way, and will likely offer a ride to two or three other people, people in my local area I may never have met; people, who like me, care about the issues facing the LGBT population. For my friends and I, this is a great opportunity. And don’t be so certain that we’ll all just go home and do nothing afterward. If you don’t support it, stay the fuck home, who needs your negativity anyway. Blog yourself into a stupor, in your own little world. Many of us want the National Equality March to be a great success are are using it as an opportunity to refresh our own fighting spirit and to connect with others who feel the same.  

I’ll probably go.Not that I don’t agree with much of what you say, but I live on Capitol Hill in DC.  And the only thing worse than a march that doesn’t really solve any problems …
… is a march that doesn’t really solve any problems because no one showed up.
So, yeah … if there’s a march, I’ll probably go.  And I’ll hold up a sign and I’ll stomp and shout for all those folks from the midwest and west coast who, understandably, couldn’t see their way to pay their way to DC for a march they don’t really think will change anything.

Wow!It’s no wonder Prop 8 passed last year. The level of cynicism and ego is astounding. To the naysayers, particularly Alvin, whether you care to acknowledge it or not, we need every voice possible if our cause for equality is to succeed. Again, for many people this is an opportunity to actively participate; why disparage them and their aspirations? I saw the video of the so-called leadership summit last month in California, it was a disgrace and only served the cause of our enemies. The old adage applies here; if you don’t have anything good to say, don’t say anything at all. If all you care to bring to the table is your negativity and your over-inflated view of your own importance, do the polite thing and keep your mouth shut. Of course, we all know you are omniscient, and can see the outcome of all things.  

Senior leaders I respect are showing upSean Strub (POZ magazine AIDS activist, David Mixner, Cleve Jones ect.  Those who don’t want to go, don’t go.  Michael Petrelis, the SF rabblerouser,  said last month no one should go, and now that money has been raised, he is calling for the auditing of funds. We certainly have our share of queens trying to rule everyone’s actions.  Alot can happen between  now and then to galvanize the community.  I have booked a hotel room.

Doing the mathConservatively –
Gas = $70
2 hotel rooms in DC x 1 night = $300
2 cross-country RT airfares = $600
2 days food x 3 people = $120
Total = $1,090 for 3 people to stand outside the Capitol
$1,090 = 54,500 flyers to distribute to people in your locality urging them to contact their representatives to demand equality for America’s LGBT people.

“If you don’t have anything good to say, don’t say anything at all.”You mean like you when you said, “If you don’t support it, stay the fuck home, who needs your negativity anyway. Blog yourself into a stupor, in your own little world,”, “your over-inflated view of your own importance” and “Of course, we all know you are omniscient, and can see the outcome of all things,”?
I have probably said all of the above myself at some point, but at least I didn’t post “If you don’t have anything good to say, don’t say anything at all”, in the same thread.

And…

afterwards going back to our own communities (who many of us do not support as we should) without a clue as to our next course of action

AND without all of the money forked out to attend this money-sucking fest, money that local communities need much more than HRC and all of the corporate behemoths that will be sucking up all of that money (not to mention time and energy) from us.

A national march will provide excellent photo ops (for us and the religious right)

The latter, of course, will spin it as yet another example of a ‘gay community’ that is more well-off financially than America at large – and, as such, does not need a law such as ENDA.
A few weeks ago on Real Time, one of Bill Maher’s ‘New Rules’ was “Democrats never learn.”
Neither do queers.
If there’s one thing that we need right now less than the Olson-Boies suit, its this fiasco-to-be.

“Why all the negativity? “Four words:
M
M
O
W

Yes, but some are using vacation timeCompare that to a week in NYC.  I bid on a room at priceline, and won a room at $99.00 a night at a four star hotel, The Mayflower, in the White House area.  Booking this early can save big bucks.  Many authors of the Dallas Principles are going.

I am concerned about the timing, more than anythingAs Alvin points out, Congress will not even be in session, and we still do not know whether Ref 71 will make the November ballot in Washington State (where I live), repeal of H8 may be on the ballot in California, the marriage battle is shaping up in Maine, and every worthy charity I can think of is short on cash.
Anybody who thinks that the March on Washington won’t siphon money off of every other important cause is kidding themselves.
This is the worst possible time to do this, considering both the economy and the November election. If people are spending their time and resources going to Washington they are not spending as much of either as they otherwise could have to help with the ballot issues during the critical period before an election–people do not have an unlimited supply of time, money or other resources.
I think that the idea of a March on Washington is a good one, but,IMHO, timing it for so close to an election when state can and do have LGBT rights issues on the ballots is not wise strategy. It would have been better strategy to time it for mid-way between elections.

Good pointBut there is a boiling point.  Many at the march, including myself, gave alot of money to defeat Prop 8 in California, and we are angry.  This is a healthy way to heal, being with like minded others.  Gay Pride events just don’t address that anger and read the challenges that Pam and others in North Carolina have gone through with local lawmakers.  They were slapped in the face by those they thought were supporters.  

(And I Tell You) I Am Not Going!There are 78 days until Maine votes on rescinding marriage equality. The “National Equality March” October 10-12th ends 22 days before the vote.
I think it is fine for people to go to DC if they want to, but to me it is crystal clear that the more effective way to forward the LGBT movement would be for all those people who are going to send that money to Maine instead. I think, for the most part, the people that would go to the March in DC probably wouldn’t have donated to the Maine NO ON 1 anyway so in the end there’s probably not much of a negative impact.
But if someone asks me, I think I have the right to express my opinion.
That weekend is basically the only weekend I have free before the election to go to Maine to help defeat Question 1, so I will probably do that.
You do your thing, I’ll do mine.

Bright, Shiny ThingsIt’s simple to go to Washington.  It’s an LGBT-friendly place (just don’t mouth off to a police officer), has great hotels, fun clubs and every cuisine in the world.  Mid-October can be a great time to visit – the heat isn’t oppressive and the trees are in color.
If everyone who attends commits to spend in the next year the same amount as he or she paid for the trip, in direct financial support for local LGBT grassroots organizations like community centers, and state-based advocacy organizations, I will be happy.
But that’s not bright and shiny.  Making progress at home is hard work, even if all one does is write a check.
When the organizers and supporters publish a concrete plan to follow up with every person who attends the event, and to use them effectively in local efforts, I’ll get behind them 100%.  That piece was missing from each previous march, turning each, no matter how well-run or poorly-run, into bright shiny things, with less substance than hoped for.
HRC has made a start:

“It’s our intention and our obligation to ensure that in October, we amplify our energy not divert it. Will and commitment are unlimited resources.  We intend to ensure that when the event in Washington is over, many more of us will know not only the work that lies ahead, but how to turn that energy into action.”

They have seven weeks to create a structure to make that happpen.  I hope they’re successful.

pssst…Then don’t go.Like the illogical argument that a vote for Nader meant another vote that would have gone to Gore in 2000, there is also no logic behind the idea that money spent on a trip to DC equates to dollars that would automatically go to another LGBT cause (pick your favorites because there will be NO agreement on that either).
Please tell me what I should do right now to secure my citizenship rights in this country.  
I will only do what YOU tell me is the right thing to do that will (guarantee) the best results.  There can be no disagreement about which action is best.  Any disagreement is an invitation to smear the idea and stifle it and act like a tea bagger/birther/heathcare Stepford wife.  
I will no longer come up with my own plans without seeking your approval first.  
I will wait for you to have the ideas, the prognostication of the outcome, and the power to create a reasonable consensus among our peers.  
Thank you for encouraging me to follow a nonexistent leadership and not take initiative to lead.  
Good job!

D.C. also is where Federal laws are maderepressing each and every one of us. ENDA, DADT, DOMA.  The idea of any march is to attract the national press.  This will do it, as the film MILK made a big impact on political public figures and started the LGBT ball rolling.  Harvey Milk will be remembered as he was the other day with a freedom medal.  This march is an extention of the fight for justice expressed in the film and by Milk’s spilled blood. Not bright and shiny as you suggested.  

as a march veteran……this March appears to be a bit of a Potemkin village. The first march 30 years ago was a true community event…for all the endless hagglng over slogans and positions it was beautifully grassroots. At that and the next one the massive parade of buses and carpools to DC were an inspiration. This one feels hollow and ill-timed.
The last one, the one that the HRC dominated, was a horrid affair. It failed to use the words “lesbian” or “gay” in the thousands of ugly blue signs printed for the occasion. It marked the final ascent of the corporate gay lobby we have now. The propaganda for this march, despite the militant posturing of Cleve Jones, follows in this corporate, closeted tradition.
Worst of all, this march is politically ill-timed. I think the gay community offering itself up to the media to paint it as more looney-tune shouters opposing Obama is incredibly stupid.
There are lots of enemies out there; lots of battles to be joined. This one is a bad choice.
I won’t be going.

State by StateFighting state by state is a necessary part of striving for equality, but I think national efforts are necessary too.  If we ever want to move past the state by state efforts we have to keep working on the national front too, both in terms of legislation, in terms of challenging in the courts inequality in the law, and in terms of national protests… all the same things we do on the smaller state by state level.

Carrying signs and shouting slogans for the benefit of President Obama (but definitely not Congress because they won’t be in session), the folks at home, or whoever may be watching television just isn’t going to cut it for me.

I think Obama needs to see a strong and targeted message, and it’d do the folks at home some good too.  We definitely need to keep trying to shape him into the ally we need.

money and people that could be used elsewhere

I think the operative word here is could, and the real question we should be asking is using the word “would”
Would the money and people be used elsewhere?  I with such a large and diverse group as the lgbt community is, that we have a lot of diversity in what motivates people & that not all the manpower & money that this event can generate would necessarily be generated by smaller more localized efforts.
For any facebook users out there:
http://www.new.facebook.com/pa…
Lastly I’ll just add this point.  The more involved I have gotten with LGBT rights, the more involved I want to get.  I think this is a very important point, and I’ll say it again.  The more involved I have gotten with LGBT rights, the more involved I want to get.  I think people will be more likely to donate to all the major lgbt rights battles going on out there, and more likely to get involved in their own local battles, if they feel like they are a part of a movement… and I think that is a much better option than limiting ourselves to only fighting for 1 right at a time, because we can’t afford to fight for more at once… that would be a very slow path to victory.

I understand your frustration with CaliforniaBut living in Washington State, I am particularly concerned because if Ref. 71 gets on the ballot it will coincide with the March on Washington. We are already seeing too much complacency and over confidence about Ref 71.
Going by the polls, we should theoretically have an easy win here, but the polls only take into account attitudes, not the confusion between “Decline to Sign” the petition to get Ref. 71 on the ballot and then having to APPROVE 71 to retain the DP expansion if it does; the ongoing confusion is painfully obvious in the “comments” sections of our newspapers’ online editions. We need people on the ground, doing voter education and we need money to fund things like TV ads; we cannot assume that word will get out by print media and internet alone–not enough people read carefully.
In California, they were fighting for marriage when they had already secured all of the rights and responsibilities that we are fighting to get enacted into law here. Here in Washington, our DPs don’t provide adequate protections for LGBT families and senior citizens; for some people, this referendum could literally be the difference between life and death.

?

.C. also is where Federal laws are made
repressing each and every one of us. ENDA, DADT, DOMA.

The only ENDA that would repress me is the one that HRC and Barney Frank actually want.

Well saidWe should feel a part of the USA as well as working at the state level.  
If the writer wants to stay at home in South Carolina and watch the action on TV that’s fine.  He can continue letter writing to Senator Lindsay Graham hoping for a miracle.

I’d rather do Maine or Washington State, personally1) I’ve never been to Maine. (I was in Wshington state briefly with my long distance honey but we never got to Seattle as we had planned!)
2) Unlike previous MOWs, there is very significant action going on at the state level which will impact th rest of the coutry, even and esp. Prop 8 repeal efforts in California and ramping up the pressure for needed federal action.
I don’t think, however, that this indicates a fracture in the community but moreso that we are fighting a war on multiple fronts.

Federal LawsDC is certainly the place where Congress debates Federal law.  It’s naive to believe it’s where laws are made.  Every Representative and Senator makes his or her decision on how to vote on bills (particularly controversial ones) based substantially on constituent opinion.  The other influencing factor is professional lobbying, which admitted occurs largely in DC, but which has nothing at all to do with a march.
No past march has ever resulted in a positive change in federal law.  None, zip.  Although, each attracted substantial coverage by the national press.
Now my senator, Jim Webb (D-VA) is an example of how citizen-based direct lobbying (the only thing that’s ever worked before) might work now.  When he ran in 2006, Webb publicly supported DADT.  Today I think he’s one that can be converted.  But, despite the fact that he lives ten miles from the Capitol, and might actually see the march, he’s not going to be persuaded by a crowd, no matter how large, that can’t that day be parsed to inform him of the number of Virginia voters involved and their positions on DADT.  
For Webb and other senators, a petition effort, like the one HRC is sponsoring now
http://www.thepetitionsite.com…
is much more effective than a crowd that may or may not contain anyone who can actually vote for him.
And it’s cheap.

You can have it both waysstay home and support my lgbt community in my own way whether it be volunteering at the local center, attending fundraisers, writing on my blog, or talking one-on-one to those questioning their orientation.
I already do all of these, except for attending fundraisers (I don’t have the cash), yet I’m still carpooling with friends and sleeping on the floor to attend the march.  I figure it won’t cost my family of 3 much more to attend than staying home would, provided we bring our own food.  I don’t see it as a particularly glamorous way to spend a weekend.  Rather, it’s just another small thing that one might do to help the LGBT movement.  In this case, it’s about national media visibility, rather then helping individuals one-on-one.  Ultimately, we need a diversity of approaches.
Truthfully, no one single action is going to do much for us, that’s why it’s been (and will continue to be a long struggle).  IMO, expending countless energy attacking one march as a diversion and a waste of time misses the point.  In isolation, you could call all single incidents of activism a waste of time.

I’ll be in Maine!What a surprise, huh?
Check out the signature line- it stays in place until AFTER November 3rd!

The only way it could be a positive eventin my opinion.
Would be if every local cause had tents there and the march organizers actively encouraged people to go to the tents and volunteer. But I have not heard any plans for this.
Unless there is an actual reason to march on Washington (pending federal legislation, etc.) there is no value in this action. Like another poster said, “its a bright shiny object.”
This can be seen in the actions of those who are overly supportive of this event. Instead of answering the concerns raised, they instead talk about how it will make them feel or shout done the opposition.

if you don’t have anything good to say, don’t say anything at all

Ah, I forgot, this is not a place to discuss issues in a respectful way, and those who hold another opinion should shut up. Sarcasm off.  

correctionthat should read.
“Would be if every local and state cause had tents”
and “feel or shout down the opposition.”
Wow, need more coffee

My point exactlyYou see, you make my point. While everyone seemed to have been concerned about Proposition 8, where was this concern when the anti-gay marriage bill passed in South Carolina?
There was no concern because the powers that be wrote us off in the South just like they continue to do.
A march and your comments about naysayers illustrate the point I am making about this forced homogenization of the lgbt community and not acknowledging that our energy would be spent educating ourselves and empowering ourselves in our communities ACROSS the nation.
And that comment about keeping mouths shut is more of an illustration. So if some of us do not abide by plans that have been “set before us” we are supposed to keep quiet because apparently we are sheep who need to be led by some self appointed deciders of what is or isn’t important to our community?
I think not.

although your adviceabout booking early and saving money is good advice, it does not answer the point raised.
The point made by jlsrva; if I can be so bold, is that the money spent on going to Washington can be better spent on other activities. Like printing fliers.
Do you have a counter argument?

Saying nothing at allallows for those opposed to speak for you.
Far better to have many voices speak up, weigh in with their thoughts and opinions (and yes, dissent), and work together towards understanding each other’s views. Only then can a game plan be considered and implemented successfully, imo.

Maine is pretty terrific!But then again, I’m kinda GONNA say that, huh?

“you never can tell what is going to happen”Sure you can.  The 1993 March on Washington was a rousing success (a million attendees!) as a result of careful long-range planning, and more than two years of organizing and outreach to allied communities (POC, women’s groups, etc.)  This march, as near as I can tell, is being put together by the seat of our pants, at best.  If you plan carefully, as the ’93 organizers did, you can be fairly certain of the outcome (always allowing for the unexpected, of course).  If you don’t do much careful planning (e.g. scheduling the march at a time when congress won’t be there, so no lobbying can take place), all you can do is hope for the best, shrug and say things like “you never can tell what is going to happen.”  Our movement deserves better than that.

Survey – How Many ARE Helping in Maine & WashingtonClick here to take a quick poll on the discussion of the National Equality March vs. the State Repeal Efforts:  http://www.pamshouseblend.com/…

“if you don’t have anything good to say, don’t say anything at all.”

The old adage applies here; if you don’t have anything good to say, don’t say anything at all. If all you care to bring to the table is your negativity and your over-inflated view of your own importance, do the polite thing and keep your mouth shut. Of course, we all know you are omniscient, and can see the outcome of all things.

A very convenient way of dismissing opposing viewpoints, huh?  The logical conclusion to be drawn from that is that we should all feel an obligation to support anything anyone does, not matter how ill-conceived, poorly planned, short-sighted or downright counterproductive it might be.  A great many of the concerns raised about this march strike me as quite cogent and valid.  But people with legitimate concerns should stay silent about them because…? because…?  because…?  Well, I can’t think of a good reason.  Maybe you can provide one.  

“D.C. also is where Federal laws are made”Yes–when congress is in session.  That won’t the case when the march happens.  No lobbying will take place; there’s not even a chance of it.  Legislators who might possibly be moved by the sight of a large number of LGBT constituents won’t be there.

Imposing Your Opinion Against The March vs. Agianst Same-Sex MarriageI view the debate about the March in the same manner as the very debate about same-sex marriage.  We can agree to disagree about same-sex marriage, but respect my belief and don’t impose your beliefs on my life and take away my right to legally marry the one that I would love.  Conversely, we can agree to disagree about the National Equality March, but respect my belief and don’t try to stop me from going to Washington D.C. to march for my LGBT civil rights.  If you don’t believe in the March, then don’t march, but let others march, because our LGBT civil rights movement will suffer if we limit any opportunities that come before us.

Slowly? I don’t think we were ever very tightly wrapped.  
But after decades of pretending to be upright citizens it has become apparent to me that we are suffering from wet brain.
I’m going to DC.  I sent money to Maine.  I prefer a repeal of 8 in 10.  There is no mutual exclusivity here.  Does anyone have independent thought anymore?  
I think debates like these sound like they are lead by a bunch of morons.  We operate under the either/or mentality that is far too prevalent in our culture.  Democrat or Republican.  male or female.  gay or straight.  work within the system or work outside it.  spit or swallow.
And now we can attack each other anonymously as a way to show that we are RIGHT and clever and mercenary.  
Ain’t the internet grand?  

Why Money For the National Equality March is Well SpentMattkazoo, money spent on this march is going to be minimal, and the purpose of the March is to mobilize and galvanize our LGBT community as well as to make a very visible stand in front of our U.S. government as we demand our full equal civil rights everywhere in America.  Civil rights movements are won when rights are granted on a Federal level, and only going state by state, though important, will be futile in the end.  Take a look at the African-American Civil Rights Movement of the 1960′s – they won their federal rights.  This is what we have been trying to do over the last few days, and this is what we should continue to do today into the future no matter how long it takes for us to get our equal civil rights.  Martin Luther King said, “How Long? Not Long! The arc of the moral universe is long, but it bends towards justice! How Long? Not Long!”

Good Pointn/t

I agreeThe mutual exclusiveness on this topic is nerve wracking.
Now yes, I have personal preferences as to where I want to spend my money and esp. my time. But I support both because both are needed.  

The 1963 March Needed Nine Months to be PlannedAnd the 1963 March was not announced until June 11, 1963 – less than three months before the march itself on August 28 for over 200,000 people who went to plan their trips and get there.
http://www.crmvet.org/tim/tim6…
The March focused on the activities of the march itself and speeches made at the Lincoln Memorial, and the National Equality March of 2009 is focusing on the same activities, which will not take as much money as previous LGBT marches.  
Over 200,000 people went to the 1963 March, despite the little time they had to plan their trips, because they wanted to be seen and heard in making a stand for freedom and civil rights.  LGBT people should have the same attitude of being seen and heard on a national level as we demand freedom, equality and our civil rights.
If your civil rights mean something to you, you will do what you can to get out to Washington D.C. and march with us.  It depends on what is really important to you in your life.

Go the MOW or your gay card is revoked!nice…

This is an oversimplificationA large part of the time planning for the ’93 MOW was spent trying to bring everyone on board for racial and gender parity, despite fierce hostility from many parts of the gay community.  Likewise, there were ferocious debates about the March organizers’ outreach to non-LGBT organizations (the NAACP and NOW, to name only two).  Resolving those issues was a matter of person-to-person, face-to-face coalition building.
The internet could not make any of that easier.  If nothing else, there’s the fact that the IndeGayForum and Gay Patriot crowd are online too, and those same new technologies can make it much easier for them to organize their resistance and opposition.  Not to mention the fact that bringing non-gay organizations of board takes a lot of time cultivating relationships, striking agreements with them, etc.  There’s a big difference between organizing an ad hoc local protest and organizing a successful national event.  
The effort to create a movement based on true freedom and equality is no easier now than it was in the 90s.  If anything, the new communications technologies can exacerbate the problems, though they obviously help in some ways too.  If the only goal were to stage an event, any event at all, you’d have a point.  

Even if Congress is not in SessionThere are other important people you can visit while in Washington that can make a difference for our community.  Visit the national offices of PFLAG, HRC, SMYAL, or your favorite charity.  Donate your time and find out their national strategy and find out how your state can assist.  Don’t just come to DC to be seen.  Do something.

The Symbolism of Strength is Never ShallowIt is the combination of local and national protests that work together to win our rights at the local, state and federal level.  We should fight for our rights locality by locality, state by state.  But our civil rights movement will not be resoundingly successful until we take this fight to the federal level, taking a stand in front of America that we mean business in fighting for our civil rights as we pressure Congress and our President to pass legislation and issue executive orders and file court cases to be heard by the US Supreme Court.  It can be argued that people take us seriously when we make a serious stand, and showing up with hundreds of thousands of people at Washington D.C. is such a serious stand that can not be ignored anywhere in America.  Chances are someone is going to make an electrifying and resounding speech that transcends the march and our movement and gets heard and seen on television stations all across America, and that kind of difference maker can not be bought with any money or resources.  Look at the African-American Civil Rights Movement – their successes became permanent once they won their rights federally with the Civil Rights Acts and Voting Rights Acts and overturning bans on interracial marriages by the US Supreme Court.  And don’t forget how such an event can inspire and galvanize our own LGBT community towards working harder.  Someone on here said that if you are fighting for your civil rights, chances are you are going to fight harder for your civil rights as time marches on.  People disagree about this march, and people disagreed about the 1963 March on Washington for Jobs and Freedom, but there was value with the 1963 march, and there is value with this year’s march, and our LGBT civil rights movement should take every opportunity that it can get to push forward our movement and galvanize our community in our persistent and consistent efforts towards the bedrock change that we seek in America.

There Are Ways You Can Budget This TripYou can find someone to go on the trip with you and cut your hotel costs in half.  There are hostels that are much more affordable to the budget-minded person.  You can also try to find someone you may know in Washington D.C. who may offer a couch for you to save more money.
Airfare tickets may be expensive in some areas, but in many areas they are surprisingly very affordable – I bought my ticket from San Francisco to Washington D.C. for less than $300, and it is much cheaper from other cities closer to D.C.
Washington D.C. has an excellent public transit system, and you can get from point A to B using their subway system and buses pretty easily.
If the National Equality March means something to you, you do what you can to get there, cutting costn s based on innovative and creative ways, and you never give up.

I’m not just talkingabout the amount of money spent by organizations. I’m talking about the money spent by those attending the March.
And you are overly simplifying the Civil Rights movement of the 60′s. The movement largely only started to win (I don’t know if you realize this, but the the civil rights movement was going on long before the 60′s), after many states had already begun to change their laws.
History is important.
And yes federal laws are important, especially since we have federal laws that prevent the transfer of rights across state lines. But real change begins at the local level. Why do you think the repub’s are encouraging disruption of local town hall meetings regarding health care. Because if people have the chance to hear the truth, the people will demand change. Why do you think Martin Luther King Jr led protests and other events at the local level, he didn’t spend a lot of his time in Washington….because he realized that real change begins in the streets.
A change of a federal law will not make those people who want to beat you up for being LGBT; stop and reconsider what they are doing because congress passed ENDA.
And that change will not occur in the first place if those who pass the laws believe that those opposing the laws outnumber those who favor the laws. And before you bring it up, a March in Washington will not change that perception, a few thousand or even a million do not counter the 25% of Americans that identify as fundamentalist evangelical christians opposed to LGBT rights.    

Never Ignore Our Nation of 50 States for the Sake of 1 StateAnd I mean this will all the love and support in the world for Maine and maybe Washington.  But hear me out – fundamental civil rights for a suspect minority class should never be put to a public vote, because these fundamental rights are tied to our core equal (and in some places inalienable) rights to life, liberty and happiness as ordained by our federal and state constitutions.  We are caught in a very unfavorable position of defending ourselves in a very un-American gesture to let the public take away our rights.  If this happened to the African-American Civil Rights Movement, who knows how much longer they would have waited for the rights that they got.  But that didn’t happen, because the African-American Civil Rights Movement won their rights on the Federal level in a way that would be near impossible to be challenged and overturned.  And this is what we have to do within our LGBT Civil Rights Movement.  We have to challenge Prop 8 federally in court and argue that Prop 8 was unconstitutional, and this is what Baies and Olsen are doing.  We have to challenge the Defense of Marriage Act and argue that that too is unconstitutional, and the State of Massachusetts and other parties are doing that.  By solely focusing our efforts in public elections, we are asking for our rights.  My friends, we never ask for our rights, we demand and take our civil rights.  And that is why we can never ignore our opportunity to make a stand in Washington D.C., be on the offensive instead of be on the defensive, and demand our civil rights as human beings in this country.

the post about new technologies made me smile a littleSo SFNative, do you build an effective coalition with non-LGBT groups before or after you tweet about what you ate for breakfest?
Look at some of the pictures of the small local prop 8 protest. I see a lot of the people participating texting each other about how great it is to be there. So instead of people yelling or protesting….you have people looking down into their cell phones….
YEAH TECHNOLOGY!  

re-abilityHi, just a quick note. If you’re going to leave large posts like the one above; please include spaces or paragraphs. Its a little hard to read your posts.

Dr. King quoteIn my opinion, ANY visibility is good. The March on Washington is visibility, even in its most basic form. Whose to say then we cannot come back fired up and ready to work for our rights?
Now’s not a time to turn on each other.
“We blacks have moved from segregation to desegregation, but our basic condition and position in American society have not changed. We who were once invisible are now, visible, but we have presence without power. The nation’s institutions have been seductive in their efforts to recruit us. But after we have been seduced into becoming “a part of” them, we have discovered once again our impotence in American society. We are still unable to help restructure those institutions that once structured us out.
We are to be seen but not heard. We are used to attract new money and new participants and to satisfy conscience, but we are told in a hundred ways that our experience, our expertise have nothing to contribute toward major issues. Our gifts become universal when we display them in the world of music or athletics, but we have no gifts to offer in decision-making, reorganizing, restructuring.”

Washington Staters need to stay home.The Columbus Day weekend is the last weekend before our ballots for the November election are mailed out.  WA now votes by mail, and this change has entirely altered campaign strategies.  Gone are the days of standing in front of voting places and holding signs or handing out fliers.  The entire campaign schedule has moved up, and Columbus Day weekend is our last chance to talk to voters face-to-face when we know they haven’t voted yet.  I’d like to echo what Susan_F has said above: we need Washingtonians to stay home and work to be sure that people vote to APPROVE the retention of our new domestic partnership law.  This is serious business.  As we know from Prop 8, assumptions of “it’s in the bag” lead to bad results.
Referendum 71 voters will be asked to approve or reject the domestic partnership law.  To preserve the new domestic partnership law, vote APPROVED in November.  Sign up with Washington Families Standing Together to help get the word out.
REFERENDUM 71 Ballot Title
Statement of Subject: The legislature passed Engrossed Second Substitute Senate Bill 5688 concerning rights and responsibilities of state-registered domestic partners [and voters have filed a sufficient referendum petition on this bill].
Concise Description: This bill would expand the rights, responsibilities, and obligations accorded state-registered same-sex and senior domestic partners to be equivalent to those of married spouses, except that a domestic partnership is not a marriage.
Should this bill be:
Approved ___
Rejected ___

the law cannot make a man love me

A change of a federal law will not make those people who want to beat you up for being LGBT; stop and reconsider what they are doing because congress passed ENDA.

“It maybe true that the law cannot change the heart but it can restrain the heartless.  It may be true that the law cannot make a man love me, religion and education will have to do that, but it can restrain him from lynching me.  And I think that’s pretty important also.  And so that while legislation may not change the hearts of men, it does change the habits of men.  And we see this every day”
-Martin Luther King, Jr.

Paragraphs are fun

as we pressure Congress and our President to pass legislation and issue executive orders and file court cases to be heard by the US Supreme Court.

But that won’t happen until the political figures understand that they will not lose their jobs by having a pro-LGBT stance. You over simplify the whole issue.
How do you think these federal laws are passed? Although I would like to think it is done in a vacuum with only the best intentions in mind……I live in reality.  

while it is important to have laws that protect usread the quote again.
And the context that I mentioned MLK Jr. I did not say he was totally against federal laws, etc. I was talking about getting a message heard by the people on the street (by mentioning the health care “debates” as an example).
Real change comes from the streets

It may be true that the law cannot make a man love me, religion and education will have to do that  

Kinda proves my point…..if you read what I wrote in context.

I understand what you were getting at nowThanks for the clarification.

March on WashingtonAs a resident of the Washington, DC, area I have seen hundreds of “marches on Washington” in the years I have lived here. While momentarily impressive (but only if the numbers of participants is stratospheric and the media covers them), very few of these marches have anything to show in terms of changing the status quo. What is the expected outcome of the National Equality March?
Better than marching on the city where the general attitude is “ho-hum” (and that includes the media present here) a better strategy would have been to plan an “assault” on Capitol Hill – a “Visit Your Representative and Senator Day”. Believe me, nothing impresses lawmakers more than to be confronted by their own constituents bearing a list of grievances. And I do not mean a replica of the ignorant, mean-spirited unmannerly so-called Town Hall gripe-sessions being resorted to by opponents of health care reform or of President Obama.
Most members of Congress will either meet personally with constituents or assign a senior aide to spend time to hear grievances and suggestions for changing or creating new laws. It is called LOBBYING and it has a direct impact on the people who matter.
It is true that some members of Congress would snub a group of GLBT citizens, but think about the fall-out and the publicity to be gained by such an action.  GLBT citizens, peacefully seeking a redress of grievances from their elected Representative or Senator…on the grounds of the Capitol, no less. Keeping a list and publishing the names of these individuals who have homophobia problems can have a much more powerful effect on their political futures than a one-day, not-even-being-present-to-see-it march will.
To those planning on attending the March: Enjoy your visit to our fabulous Washington, D.C., but do not have high expectations for political action or positive results. It’s OK to feel good about your GLBTness, but it will accomplish nothing, given the nature of the political climate in Washington, DC right now (and perhaps, an even more dispiriting and dangerous climate in October).
Pineapple

Seriously, this is not a Gestapo its a civil rights campaign There are too many people making ultimatums on what everyone else should be doing when the very fact that our community is so large and so diverse just dictates we are going to be putting forth a multitude of efforts in many different directions. If we are being pragmatic then we need to acknowledge that diversity, and the infighting and conflict that may come with it. The process is after all as much a part of the learning curve as everything else we do. By the same token we need to be united in our efforts to be accepting and supportive of each other and the variety of personal expressions we will have when the wider society and the media come calling. Criticism off the backs of those within the community is no way to build a reputation.
And can be just as hurtful in the wider media than anything we do or don’t do together.
They call it infighting for a reason. Keeping it in the family is one thing, venting in the wider community because you disagree with the direction someone else has chosen to express their ire at inequality is just too much and lends more to the dehumanization of the community than anything else does. It should not be a question of either or but a question of why not support it all. Because the real hypocrisy is in trying to create homogeneity in a population that celebrates diversity. We will get there! But we also need to be able to do it on our own terms and in our own variety of ways.    

4.00/1All of this DRAMA  is predicted on either/or premises that only exists in people’s minds.

But kudo451are we still allowed to have opinions on an issue. Remember the title of the original article “Why I DO NOT support October’s national equality march.”
Not why you should not support, or you must not support.
A lot of the “Drama” if you read through the comments is not caused by the individuals wishing to debate the merits or lack of merit of a March. Its caused by a few individuals who demand you support the march or shut up.
Its not allowing a differing opinion at all, it is assuming an attack against a person’s beliefs and than attacking the perceived attacker. I’m not 100% convinced either way and could go either way. But so far those opposed to the March make better arguments and don’t tell people to shut up.

Solidarity!Hey folks, the march is going to happen, is not supporting it sending the right message?  It’s time to put away the differences and stand united.  

Hmmph. You will rip my gay card from my walletonly against my will. Also, you kids get off  my lawn.
Seriously: I have empathy for those who have not had the revolutionizing experience of marching, sitting down to stand up, facing down a hostile society. Perhaps they feel that they were born at the wrong time.
But all I can say is: You’re welcome. Those of us who paved the way in ACT-UP and Queer Nation and the ’87 MOW that preceded those developments got revolutionized.
Then we went home and made a world in which, believe it or not, we have REAL power. We have influence. 22 years ago, a Ft Worth judge let three teenagers who had trapped and killed a gay man off scot-free. Today we have an investigation and heads are going to roll over the liquor cops bashing inside a gay bar.
I feel ya, those who want to stand with their peers around the country and make a statement. But again, you can do a whole lot more locally with the money and time that will cause real change, not a feeling of empowerfullness.
You’re welcome. Now get to work, because for the first time in the history of our movement we are making real, tangible political gains. Instead of traveling to DC, learn how to register voters and get hopping.

I don’t see a problem with supporting all course of actionsand doing what is best for you according to your situation and interests. I really don’t.

Yeah, if i had the scratch and the timeto fly somewhere in the East for a weekend, you bet I’d be going to Maine.
They’re going to win the fight to protect marriage at the ballot box, and that’s going to shift the ground under our movement. It’s also going to profoundly change the tactics used by our opponents.
The opportunity to be a part of that is a once in a lifetime thing.

Printing pamphletswon’t reach mainstream media, and that is what is needed.  A possible show of Sean Penn, Brad Pitt and his lovely wife Angelina will produce a media frenzy.  And these people believe in our rights, not paid celebrities.  It is a real possibility that they will show up.  The successful march in the 1990′s had Cybil Shepard out front.  Larry King and the media ate it up.  The other marches the media yawned at.  America is celebrity nuts and the masses will tune in to hear what they have to say.  Brad Pitt’s issue is gay marriage as he stated today and yesterday on every news program.

Me either, but the attitudeis a bit much.
Yes, Virginia, it’s possible for well-meaning LGBT people to value the same outcome while vociferously disagreeing on the appropriate tactics, and I’m not going to be told ‘shut up and stop trying to influence thinking’.

How easily it’s forgottenthat the civil rights movement of the sixties was hardly unified. Martin Luther King faced fierce opposition from within the black community in many, if not all, the things he did. No social or civil rights movement has ever been united and if we can’t allow respectful dissent than we’re no better than the people who are trying to keep us down.

No, I’m not trying to shut you or anyone upI’m trying to see if I have the scratch to do Maine for a week, actually. (or the vacation time for that matter)…
If I’m arguing anything in hear, it would be for the “it’s all good” approach.

“a feeling of empowerfullness”can be a good motivator, a belief in your own efficacy can make a word of difference in how active one is in standing up for lgbt equality, and I wouldn’t be quick to discount it.  I for one support the idea of the march & of acting locally.  

Good point, MattThe bigger point, which I don’t think I stated as well as I might have, is simply this:  What is broadly called the LGBT community is much more diverse and much more fractious than, say, the black community was in ’63.  Just look at the wide range of viewpoints we get here on the Blend–reactionary trolls; Obamabots who don’t think we should ever do anything that might distress the Democrats plus fierce critics of Obama; totally cool trans people plus trans people who insist that all white males, gay or straight, are the very embodiment of evil; LGBT POC; genderqueer people and “straight-acting” types; high school students and crusty old men like me; and a lot more besides.  Throw in the Gay Patriot loonies, the IndeGayForum androids and the much less inflammatory but still problematic AmericaBlog types, and what you have is a pretty neat picture of chaos.  
The ’93 march organizers came closer to shaping all of them (and a lot more besides, of course) into a unified, energized whole than anyone I’ve ever seen.  And they did it through an enormous amount of long-range planning and organizing.  I can’t see that anyone involved in this current march has even recognized the potential for doing that, much less had a serious go at it.
A March on Washington, or any national event, has great potential not just to make a splash on the media and (possibly) influence some politicians.  It can also serve as a great unifying force for our entire community, in all its diverse craziness.  It night even be argued that the main reason for staging a national event at all is just precisely that.  I think that opportunity is being overlooked and/or squandered by the people behind this year’s march.  Which means it might make a splash for a weekend but have none of the long-term benefits it might.

You’re welcome.Then again, I missed you at the first LGBT MOW on October 14, 1979. And no doubt, those whose shoulders I now stand on missed my presence at the first White House Picket, and on and on backward into history. But so it goes.
Look at it this way, at least we’ll have very little time for many more of these threads before this 5th (yes 5th) LGBT MOW is history.

Indeed

There Are Ways You Can Budget This Trip

I’m doing it very easily.
I’m not going.

If I want a feel good trip I’ll go to MaineI’ll cook dinner for Louise and Charlie and the girls at night, work on the No On 1 campaign during the day, and take pictures of the fall folige I haven’t seen in years. I’m seriously considering it, as I would learn a lot about working a campaign, and it would be a nice visit home to New England.
If I want to effect local change here in Hawaii I’ll donate to the Life Foundation and help them organize benefits so that local AIDS patients can keep their housing and food and medical treatments.
I spend a good chunk of my professional life in the D.C. area, and have no desire at all to be there for a hey-look-a-bunch-of-very-angry-people-yelling-about-how-angry-they-are.
Just my opinion.

Seek out your Congresscritter AT HOME during the recess!!Damn right, and well said, Pineapple.
I would seriously encourage EVERYONE to seek out their Representative and Senator AT HOME during the August recess. Neil Abercrombie is hosting a health care town hall in my district Sunday night, and I am going.
You bet your ass I am bringing up the fact that LGBT families need a public option because we don’t have the legal rights of kinship that forces employer to extend healthcare to our spouses. You bet your ass I am bringing up the fact that too many of us are the working poor, who can be fired from our jobs just for who we love, and the only decent healthcare option for us is a public one that we won’t lose, or can’t provide to our families. You bet your ass I’m going to bring up the cost of drug treatments for PWA.
You bet your ass I’m going to hound him about supporting the LGBT community on the Hill if he wants our support in his gubernatorial race. I want him to live in fear of pissing us off because we’ll end his career if he does.

I’m sorryUp the thread was an intelligent discussion about Martin Luther King’s strategy.  And now we’re hoping that Brangelina will carry the day for us.  Get a grip.  There will be neither media surprise, nor a media frenzy if Brangelina shows up up in DC.  Even if they did, and there was, it wouldn’t matter, because I can assure you that no one in Congress gives a damn.
No one tells his congressman that he’ll vote for or against him based on Brad Pitt’s opinion.  If they do, they’re nuts.
The media eats many things, and craps as much out.  What counts is letting your representative know what you’ll do in November, not what Brad Pitt says he’ll do.

Actually, YES, in some casesSome of us have found that, like it or not, our state-level rights are [or are likely to be up] for a vote: Some of us would prefer to stand in solidarity with our trans brothers and sisters in Massachusetts; some of us live in or near Washington State, where the courts found against marriage rights, domestic partnership benefits may well go to a vote, we now have mail-in voting and Columbus Day weekend is the last weekend before our ballots for the November election are mailed out; some of us live in Maine, which is a fight we can win, if people suit up and show up; many of us have children who we cannot keep out of school for the extra day to go to Washington–especially if we are Jewish and our kids just took Yom Kippur off, two weeks before the MOW. So some of us need to stay in our home states and fight for our state-level rights, lest we lose on those fronts before federal rights and protections can go to a vote.
If every single person going to the March on Washington also pledged to donate even $10 and ONE day of their time to each of the state-level battles (they can phone bank from home), some of us would be a whole lot more supportive of the MOW.
So to those of you telling those of us concerned about state-level battles to support the MOW: How ’bout you folks rise to my challenge? $10 and ONE day of volunteering for each of the states that have crucial rights on the ballot.